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2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

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2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby IwanAir » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:59 pm

Hello all, hope you can help me on problem on my 1993 Transit Laika campervan 2.5 TD Manual.

I am totally not handy with engines myself but start to know more about it every day since we’ve got this problem…

And as the mechanic in the garage doesn’t know what to do anymore I thought to check myself what is possible to fix this problem, so hope to find some help overhere...

7 weeks ago we bought this campervan and went for the a weekend with my wife and 2 kids. All went well but after 50 km driving on the highway it stopped. Went in limp mode so went on the side of the road and really didn’t know what to do at that time. Tried to start it and it runned again. But after 20km again the same problem, after 200m again, and again…

So we called SOS and they got us of the road, and send the campervan to the garage, where it still is after 7 weeks…

----

Problem/situation at the moment is that the mechanic at the garage (official Ford dealer) have replaced a new (remanufactured) fuel pump (see link below), fuel filter and timing belt to solve the problem, but now the engine jumps in limp mode directly after starting and has no power. And if he turns the engine off, the engine keeps on running for 15 seconds, unless he tries to start again – then the engine turns off.

Also if he wants to read the fault codes there is a whole list of 80 faults he says, and he can’t remove them. I already read in other topics to stall the engine by engaging 3th or 5th gear but does that solve the whole problem?

The mechanic now wants to replace the old fuel pump on Monday morning again to see if he still has the same issues to ensure the new one is okay or not. But my feeling says that the new fuel pump is fine and the problem is something else. Reading some other topics on this forum.

Hope someone can help us, mechanic will go on holiday next week, and we hope to explore Europe in 2 weeks time from now...

Thanks in advance,
Iwan
( the Netherlands)

link to the new pump we ordered from eBay;
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Reconditione ... m570.l1313
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby wojciech » Sun Jul 15, 2018 12:12 pm

About 80-90% of problems with Lucas pomp in Epic is caused by shut-off valve. It is controlled from ECU. Valve has plunger with rubber end. If his rubber end is destroyed, fuel inside pressure in pomp is incorrect. In this pomp fuel it is a hydraulic control agent for regulation valves and, timing plunger and value injecion plunger. If inside pressure is incorrect, all plungers work in bad positions, their sensors send it to ECU - system start to work in limp mode.
And the worst that systems indicate a lot of errors, but nothing about broken shut-off valve.
So - try replace plunger in shut-off valve. On picture nr 125 (red arrow). For EPIC models 1991-1994 plunger is bigger, diameter 7,62mm, it looks like in link http://www.ford-esklep.pl/pl/p/Rdzen-el ... 2.5TD/3743
Plungers for later period are unchangeable for previous.

On film is shown plunger mounting - time 7'30"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR4FIYF6E6Q

------------------------------------------------

So: plunger exanchange is simply, quick and cheap. I don't know if it will help, but it's worth a shot.
Second hint about broken plunger and shut-off valve is, that engine works some seconds when ignition key you turn off.
On Forum you can find a lot of threads about plungers for EPIC...
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby IwanAir » Sun Jul 15, 2018 1:02 pm

Thanks for that! But this is in the pump right? and the pump is completely remanufactured, so could this still be a problem?
Hope not, but will discuss this it with the mechanic tomorrow.
Thanks again
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby wojciech » Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:42 pm

IwanAir wrote:Thanks for that! But this is in the pump right? and the pump is completely remanufactured, so could this still be a problem?
Hope not, but will discuss this it with the mechanic tomorrow.
Thanks again

Once very old specialist for diesel injections systems told me: if you hit the wall that no one knows anything what is going on in EPIC (typical situation), try change plunger in shut-off valve... :mrgreen:
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby IwanAir » Sat Jul 21, 2018 8:01 pm

We have ordered a new (second reconditioned) pump last week and went on yesterday and everything looked good.
So I have picked up the campervan and went for a long drive today and it was feeling good.
Until almost home I made a stop and turned off the key, but the engine kept on running for 10 seconds (same issue as the last pump).
and when i started again it went in limp mode but managed to get home (without any power in the engine).
I have now managed to get it off limp mode by turn off the engine while stalling the engine in 3rd gear.

Is this still a problem in the pump, or could it be something else? It's not possible that all 3 pumps have the the same issue so in my opinion it must be something else...

We will bring it to another garage this week for service but any ideas are welcome to see what this could be and i can share with the garage...

We just don't trust the campervan like this to get it through Europe with the family.

Thanks again, and have a great weekend!
Iwan
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby wojciech » Sun Jul 22, 2018 10:19 am

IwanAir wrote:? It's not possible that all 3 pumps have the the same issue so in my opinion it must be something else...

Yes, I think so.
It looks as electrical problem.
Check voltage during engine work. It can be too high.
Before 1995 shut-off valve was activated from ignition key by ECU, independently for sensors indicates- so check power hold relay and ground for ECU. When you turn ignition key off, relay still works on.

Check EGR - if no dark smoke - check EGR sensor. Check EGR vacu pipe and his vacu servo. Check electric vacu valve (vacuum transducer) and all vacu pipes.
Check crankshaft position sensor and his circuit - maybe is unstable and sometimes is opened.
Check all plugs for sensors, ECU, grounds - use WD40 or special preparation for good connection.

You need luck... :?
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby Bux » Tue Dec 24, 2019 3:47 am

Hi all....anything regarding the lucas epic fuel pump can be diagnosed and repaired / replaced by specialist who work with and has stock of remanufactured epic pumps..He has the proper diagnostic tool that only works on these early transits...so you get the correct error codes.. the use of modern scan tools don't work well here and give multiple errors...they are unable to work correctly
The mechanic is in hallam vic..but also sends reco pumps via courier for your mechanic to install....If your interested..go to ebay Australia and type in lucas epic pump...the user name of this guy is promechanical,
He changed my leaky pump and did the timing belt...about 2 to 3 hrs work!...he told me he's done hundreds...I don't doubt it
With the proper scan tool something or other 2000..forget the name , it'll check your system if that's all you need...
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby medgalys » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:21 am

I know this is an old thread but I have a related question:

When changing injection plunger in epic pump does it need adjusting afterwards?
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Re: 2.5 TD Lucas Epic fuel pump problem

Postby MinorMatt » Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:56 pm

no it doesn't...
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