*NOW BOOKED FOR 2024* Transitmania 15 @ Santa Pod 19th to 21st July 2024 *ALL DETAILS HERE*


Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Use this forum to post technical questions & problems about any Transit

Moderator: Luke

Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Tue Aug 21, 2018 1:57 pm

Hi,
I know that my van is not a Ford but it has the same engine, so I hope to find a solution here.
The van is Citroen Relay/Jumper 2.2 Hdi 120hp no fap Puma engine, right now it has 176.000km, runs great but the oil consumption is around 1l for 1000km and sometimes more than 1l.
When I start the engine and during the normal use of the van I don't see any kind of smoke (Blue or White). Only if I rev up 3000rpm it smoke black (I normally use around 1500-2500rpm. The max torque is around 2000rpm)
I've bought it at 150.000km and I don't know how the old owner used it. I have the maintenance history and they changed oil every 30.000km using 5-40 and 10-40 oil.
I've changed right now 3 time the oil, around every 8000/10.000km. 2 times with liquimoly 4100 5w40 and now when I noticed the consumpion of oil I've decided to use the Motul 10w60.
The van is used for work so i don't have long time to work on. This week is my holiday week so I can work on it.
I've tried a compression test 3 of 4 cilinders have a compression around 24 bar the last around 19. The cilinder with the lowest compression have a small leak on the injector so I think this can make the difference of bar, but I'm not sure.
The turbo works fine at 2000rpm, between 1000 to 1500 there is a sort of on/off sound, The inlet manifold between the turbo and the intercooled was wet of oil but I don't know if the cause can be the vapourof oil from the valve cover.
I've tried to talk with an official citroen mechanic but the general reply was..............add oil and go on, is the cheapest way to solve the problem. :shock: :evil:
I've added an oil catch can, in the video below maybe you can see the tubes connected and the amount of vapour that the engine generates at low temps.
I don't know how to solve it, maybe can be the valve cover clogged that generates a lot of pression and blow all the oil? Is better if I change the injector seals and redo a compression test?
I know that the best way is to find a professional mechanic but right now I don't have the time, money and a professional mechanic. So, if I want to solve, I have to do it by myself. I've restored a car, a few motorbikes so a I have a bit of tools, official citroen manual, but I need the experience and few tips to work on this kind of engine.
Hope that the forum can help me.
Best Regards.
Marco.

https://youtu.be/qLJHygzbvD8
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 3:38 pm

Today I've found another problem.
Searching a solution for my problem With the engine running I've tried to pull out the oil dipstick. The reaction was like a geyser. Is it normal? Does the Ford engine a valve cover with the Pcv valve? If first I remove the oil cap filler and then the oil dipstick nothing appen. I suppose that I have too much pressure in my cranckcase.
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Mad Husky » Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:16 pm

No genius here but if there is too much crankcase pressure oil can be forced past the rings i would look at the breather system of the engine first before tearing stuff apart. I could be wrong like i said no genius.
User avatar
Mad Husky
Transit Aficionado
Transit Aficionado
 
Posts: 426
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:45 pm
Location: Wrexham

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:37 pm

I think the same.
I've found the box with the membrane( I think, it is the PCV valve) I've cleaned up but I don't know if maybe whit 176.000km is better to change it.
I have to change 2 injectors seals rings, so at this point I don't know if is better to change the entire valve/rocker cover.
It's hard to bleed the injectors? Can I do by myself this operation?
Thanks.
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Altransit » Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:39 pm

If the injector seals are leaking, then the fuel pressure can pressurise the crankcase, and will also dilute the oil with diesel fuel.
1994 Mk4 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (R.I.P.)
1997 Mk5 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (Gone, but not forgotten!)
2004 Mk6 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.0 TDDi - Vantunered (Also gone)
2008 Mk7 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.2 TDCi - Also Vantunered
User avatar
Altransit
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 40198
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire, UK

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:50 pm

Altransit wrote:If the injector seals are leaking, then the fuel pressure can pressurise the crankcase, and will also dilute the oil with diesel fuel.

Yes but the oil level maybe should grow up? Or not?
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Altransit » Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:52 pm

That depends on how much it's leaking, and how many injectors.

Mine wasn't too bad, didn't increase the oil level, didn't pressurise the oil, but did make a lot of noise and mess :roll:
1994 Mk4 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (R.I.P.)
1997 Mk5 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (Gone, but not forgotten!)
2004 Mk6 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.0 TDDi - Vantunered (Also gone)
2008 Mk7 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.2 TDCi - Also Vantunered
User avatar
Altransit
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 40198
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire, UK

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:19 pm

Altransit wrote:That depends on how much it's leaking, and how many injectors.
Only One


Mine wasn't too bad, didn't increase the oil level, didn't pressurise the oil, but did make a lot of noise and mess :roll:

It's not a big leak, it's wet but it isn't dropping fuel or oil

Can I do by myself this operation? (Tear down and reassembly the injectors -> Do I need Citroen special tools?
Thanks.
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Altransit » Wed Aug 22, 2018 6:25 pm

1994 Mk4 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (R.I.P.)
1997 Mk5 SWB 115 Minibus 70ps Di (Gone, but not forgotten!)
2004 Mk6 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.0 TDDi - Vantunered (Also gone)
2008 Mk7 SWB T280 Medium Roof 85PS 2.2 TDCi - Also Vantunered
User avatar
Altransit
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 40198
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Bicester, Oxfordshire, UK

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Ken205 » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:52 pm

I have been there only 2 months ago.
I had a blocked rocker cover it did exactly what your van is doing
If the part you took out and cleaned was the circular section on the back right corner it will get you nowhere .
If you suck on the pipe coming out of the rocker cover there should be no restriction whatsoever on the pipe.
I cut my rocker cover open after I replaced it and there is i little valve inside there that was stuck and a small sponge that was gone hard and blocked with carbon. These can't be got at without cutting it open.
If I was you I'd replace rocker cover cut injector seats new washers and new bolts and torque them. thats if you have a restriction sucking the breather pipe
Ken205
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:10 am

Ken205 wrote:I have been there only 2 months ago.
I had a blocked rocker cover it did exactly what your van is doing
If the part you took out and cleaned was the circular section on the back right corner it will get you nowhere .
If you suck on the pipe coming out of the rocker cover there should be no restriction whatsoever on the pipe.
I cut my rocker cover open after I replaced it and there is i little valve inside there that was stuck and a small sponge that was gone hard and blocked with carbon. These can't be got at without cutting it open.
If I was you I'd replace rocker cover cut injector seats new washers and new bolts and torque them. thats if you have a restriction sucking the breather pipe

Thank you.
I've tried and there is a bit of restriction.
If I grind the injectors seats should bought an increased washer or this kit can be ok for me?
https://www.ebay.it/itm/ROCKER-COVER-GA ... 1438.l2649
Thanks,
Best Regards,
Marco
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Ken205 » Thu Aug 23, 2018 10:40 am

I used thicker washers but if you don't grind them to much standard washers will do.
I be confident it's the rocker cover because there should be zero restriction. When you suck it, you are getting air through the holes that allow the oil to drain from the breathing system back into the.engine, not from the breathing system itself
Ken205
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 3:24 pm

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby rebuilder86 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:27 am

interesting, u have the same symptoms i am currently facing with a 1999 VG transit 2.5 turbo diesel.
High oil consumption (about a litre per 500 ks) and visible vapour coming from the rocker cover.
I get no smoke out the exhaust pipe.
rebuilder86
Transit Aficionado
Transit Aficionado
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 4:21 am

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby rebuilder86 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:32 am

so i have a theory.
i recon we are btoh experiencing a leak of the compressed turbocharger air, into the oil return line from the turbo into the crankcase!
That would eplain the misting up of the oil and it turning into vapour and spraying out the PCV vents and all through the engine bay.
rebuilder86
Transit Aficionado
Transit Aficionado
 
Posts: 110
Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2018 4:21 am

Re: Oil Problem, 2.2 Puma

Postby Drake1793 » Sat Aug 25, 2018 1:18 pm

rebuilder86 wrote:so i have a theory.
i recon we are btoh experiencing a leak of the compressed turbocharger air, into the oil return line from the turbo into the crankcase!
That would eplain the misting up of the oil and it turning into vapour and spraying out the PCV vents and all through the engine bay.

So you think that my problem can be caused by a bad turbocharger?
User avatar
Drake1793
Transit Addict
Transit Addict
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:04 pm
Location: Udine, N.E Italy

Next

Return to Technical Problems & Questions



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users

This site contains affiliate links for which we may be compensated.