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1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

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1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:13 pm

Hi
I've joined the forum in the hope I can get some advice about my ford transit motorhome. I recently had the cambelt, water pump and fuel filter replaced as we're planning a trip to Italy this summer and thought it would be good to get the cambelt done beforehand, unfortunately since having the work done I am having problems starting the engine. It always used to start as soon as I turned the key but now it has to turn over for a few seconds before it fires up and eventually after a couple of days it doesn't fire up at all. I've taken it back to the garage twice and the first time they replaced the fuel filter and told me I needed a new battery. I drove it home but it was still starting differently to how it used to and after about 5 days it stopped firing up again. It went back to the garage and they said they would check the cambelt and starter system. I have brought the motorhome home today and at the moment it is starting ok but the garage have suggested I have a second battery fitted to help boost the engine when starting it. This all sounds odd to me as it always started before with one battery. Can anyone advise me if this is usual practice with a Ford Transit with starting problems. The garage have suggested connecting the starter battery to my motorhome leisure battery but I'm not sure if that would damage the leisure battery? Hope someone can advise? Thanks very much
Sam
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby blizard » Wed Apr 25, 2018 2:40 pm

Welcome!
Please tell us if the problems reveiled right after the beltswap?
Does the engine smoke?
Is there air in the fuel system? Fuel filter sucking false air?
Because of the garage comment: does the starter turn smootly?
I find it weird that after changing engine parts the garage points to batteries.
These engines are bulletproof, if treated the right way

And no: do not connect these batteries together they will eat each-other, or use a cyrix relay https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victron-Intell ... B0738JGVZ9
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Gearbox MT75
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:49 pm

Hi thanks for your reply, yes the problems started immediately after the belt swap. Never had this problem before and always been reliable even in winter. It doesn't smoke once it's on the move only when it's been sitting for a few days and soon clears.
I'm not a mechanic but I did read up about getting air in the fuel filter and the garage replaced the fuel filter a second time after i suggested that it might be the problem but they are adamant there is no air trapped as once started the engine runs perfectly, which they say it wouldn't if the air was in there?
The starter motor sounds fine, no squeeling and they haven't suggested that's a problem.
One mechanic said it was low on compression and needed the extra battery to help it get going. But I just don't understand why this has just become a problem. If the timing belt was not set right would this affect the compression?
I tried to start the vehicle this morning but it was really struggling to fire so I put jump leads from my old battery to the new one so I had 2 and it started exactly how it used to. Once it's been started it runs well and starts again well but if it sits for any length of time say overnight it can't start in the morning. To be honest I'm feeling really ripped off because when I returned the vehicle the first time they tried to insinuate that I had originally brought the vehicle in with a starting problem but I had actually took it in for a new cambelt because of our holiday, I wanted to be sure the belt was ok. What a mistake! It's been really unpleasant trying to get them to look at the problem. They're very argumentative with me saying there's nothing wrong with it other than it needs this 2nd battery but there obviously is something not right. I will probably need to get a second opinion but I've already spent £630 at this garage so would prefer it if they could get it right and not make me feel so bad when I do take it back. They insist a second battery is the answer.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby gotgcoalman » Wed Apr 25, 2018 5:16 pm

could be simple as using aftermarket fuel filters causing the starting problem.
ne m'écoute pas je suis plein de merde.
A house without a dog is like a forum without a BJT.
Too bloody quiet :shock:
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:31 pm

Hi,Sam P.
Sometimes unpleasant coincidences of several unrelated events occur.
It is possible that a poor start of the motor is not associated with replacing the fuel filter.
And, most likely, is not connected with the replacement of the cam belt.
Sam P wrote:One mechanic said it was low on compression and needed the extra battery to help it get going.

Before the replacement of the belt and the filter, the compression was normal, after-catastrophically decreased?
This does not happen.
Sam P wrote:If the timing belt was not set right would this affect the compression?

Only not in the engine Transit 2.5 diesel.
Incorrect installation of the belt can lead to an accident with the valves, after which the motor does not start.
Incorrect setting of the injection timing when replacing the belt can give a late fuel injection. With this, the cold motor is badly wound up and pulls badly, works gently and quietly. There may be white or blue smoke.
The error is easily corrected by turning the TNVD shaft clockwise.
If adjustment within the slots on the injection pump pulley is not possible, remove the belt and turn the injection pump pulley clockwise on one tooth.
If the problem is not in the installation of the belt, fill a full tank of fuel.
If the engine is better to start after refueling, the problem is that fuel from the injection pump flows into the tank.
This is possible due to a malfunction of the booster pump or a loose fitting of the locking needle in any injector.
This is me about all sorts of coincidences.
If the problem is not in the installation of the belt, fill a full tank of fuel.
If the engine is better to start after refueling, the problem is that fuel from the injection pump flows into the tank.
This is possible due to a malfunction of the booster pump or a loose fitting of the locking needle in any injector.
This is me about all sorts of coincidences.
I wish you success!
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby blizard » Wed Apr 25, 2018 8:19 pm

Where are you situated, maybe a forummember could help you?
Transit MK3 1987
Chausson Motorhome
Engine 2.5TD of 2000 (last production year of the DI, I'm told)
Gearbox MT75
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:11 pm

Hi Cherniy_chack
Thanks for the advice. If I get another mechanic to look at it I will ask them to check those things. Part of me thinks it could just be a bad coincidence as you say but I'm not sure adding a second battery is the only answer?

Hi Blizard
Thanks for your help so far and the advice about the battery connection I didn't think it would be a good thing to do so I'm glad you confirmed that. I am in Leicester, UK.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby twin wheel camper » Wed Apr 25, 2018 9:32 pm

Transit di’s DONT NEED 2 BATTERYS TO START IN THE UK WEATHER FACT.
If it was ok before the garage was at it it will be almost 100% something they messed up.
My first thought would be the fuel filter is either not correctly fitted or a pipe has being disturbed and is letting diesel run back to the take after sitting a few hours.
Don’t waste your money or time with this garage anymore.
I’m sure there’s a member locally who will at least be able to point you to a garage that no what there doing.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Thu Apr 26, 2018 10:24 am

Thanks twin wheel camper I just needed someone to confirm the 2 battery thing is not the answer. I'm going to have to get a second opinion. If there's anyone out there who can recommend a good transit mechanic in the Leicester area I'd be grateful.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby rebuilder86 » Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:33 am

just to go and mudy the waters a bit.....
I have a 99 transit 2.5 Turbo diesel 74 Kw VG series, and it has 2 batteries, and wont crank properly without both hooked up. that is ; 2 x AGM (absorbent glass mat) 800 CCA batteries.
So its not 100% out of the question that it may somewat resolve the immediate apparent issues....
however, i cant see how one would need to "add a battery" during the life of an engine to keep it running properly haha. thats just ludicrous.
Trying to focus on the belt change being the cause of the new issue will only hinder your investigation.
Get a different mechanic who specialises in diesel, or transits, to inspect all of their work, and whne u find where they went wrong, pay them for their diagnosis, and take it back to the first place for rectification free of charge.
My moneys on air in fuel system. air bubbles do get stuck. they want to rise, but get pumped downwards into crevaces and nooks n crannys, and therfore never leave the system and can sometimes only cause issues during startup, a bt like a vapour lock which never "un-vapourises."
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Thu Apr 26, 2018 11:59 am

Hi rebuilder86
Is air in the fuel system something I can clear myself? or is there a way to test there is air trapped somewhere? I'm not a mechanic but I'm happy to do basic things if it won't make it worse, meanwhile I'll try and find a good local mechanic.
Thanks
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby rebuilder86 » Thu Apr 26, 2018 1:14 pm

someone gave a good process here.
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=145410
Hope it makes sense.
Otehr technice are cranking with the bleed valve (yellwo thing on fue filter) open untill air bubbles come out. (time consuming and not 100%)
And one guy on youtube, even pressurised his fuel tank (full tank of fuel) with an air compressor,he just wrapped duct tape aroung the air compressor nozzle until it was big enoguh to firmly fit in the fuel tank filler, and this forces fuel through the system and pushes air out the open bleed valve!! thats a good hack haha.
Should be a very simple process for a diesel mechanic and should cost too much if u cant sort it yourself.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Thu Apr 26, 2018 3:46 pm

Thanks for that reduilder86 really interesting it looks fairly simple but I suppose as I haven't got the kit it might be easier to get a mechanic to do it for me. The garage did put a 2nd fuel filter on the first time I took it back because I suggested there might be air in the system but they said that as I'd managed to get it going any air would have gone out through the engine so they didn't think that was the case. Are they right or are they stringing me a line do you think?
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:28 pm

So.... after reading the advice I decided to go and try getting the air out through the fuel filter but when I looked at the fuel filter I noticed that they haven't fitted a like for like fuel filter, my original fuel filter had a water in fuel sensor at the bottom and this fuel filter doesn't and they've left the sensor dangling underneath. I also got diesel on my hands as I felt under the fuel filter for the sensor so is this a sign it's leaking? surely that would let air in? I'm assuming this is not good and they should have fitted a like for like filter and not left the sensor unattached? Is this leading me to the problem?
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Riggard » Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:58 pm

Symptoms you are describing sounds a lot like the symptoms I had with my transit: Engine takes quite some time to start when van was left alone for a few days. Starting it within a day worked fine.

In my case it turned out to be a loose fitting from a fuel hose, causing air to get in the fuel.

Going by your story and symptoms, My first thoughts were air in the system. Only difference is that in your case, the fuel filter appears to be the culprit. Diesel on the bottom of a new filter, should not be there and is a tell tale sign that diesel is leaking, and air is getting in.
Maybe you can tighten it up by turning it, otherwise i'd be looking for a proper fitting filter, they're cheap.

(The garage telling you that all air should've been cleared from the system is telling you half the story; yes, the air is cleaned from the system when you drive. The other half of the story: as soon as you turn off the engine, the leak will start sucking new air in.)
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