Transitmania 6 @ Billing Aquadrome Aug 22nd to 24th 2014


Ice cream van engine problem

Transit Mk3, 4 & 5(smiley front) Forum. All Transits 1986 - 2000

Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Mon Aug 27, 2012 9:17 pm

Hello everyone,I am new here and would like,if I may, to tap some brains!

I have a problem with my mark 5. P reg 2.5 d Transit ice cream van. Last year I had a Ivor searle remanufactured engine fitted along with
new egr valve, new injectors,new pump. The problem is that after idling for more than 3 minutes I get a puff of bluish grey smoke when pulling away. After doing a fete where the engine is running for 4 hours or so I can fill the field with smoke when driving away.
The engine needs to be on as it drives a belt driven soft ice cream machine.
Oil change done every 6 weeks, only branded diesel used.New fuel and air filter every 4 months. Have had injectors tested and valve rubbers replaced. Annual mileage about 8000 although idling time is about 3 hours a day.
On normal driving the engine is perfect and does not smoke and sails through the MOT on emissions test.
Heard that idling remanufactured diesel engines before they have run in is a sure fire way to causing problems like glazed barrels.

Any help would be very gratefully recieved

Many thanks Warbling toad
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby Guy88 » Mon Aug 27, 2012 10:13 pm

my old MK6 used to do this after idling for a while,

try blanking the EGR and seeing if it helps, its probably the EGR allowing carbon to mix with oil vapor from the breather and its then burning off when driving away
2008 200 T350, LWB GLX,
1999 SWB low roof ex BT, officially rotten and awaiting restoration

REMAPPED BY http://WWW.VANTUNER.COM HE IS THE WAY FORWARD

LIVIN' LOUD

Image
User avatar
Guy88
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 16297
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 10:37 pm
Location: Banbury, oxon

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Fri Aug 31, 2012 7:39 am

Thanks, have blanked EGR valve off, just blue smoke now, having spoken to Ivor Searle and my mechs we reckon that because the engine does so much ticking over at shows that there must be one or more of the oil scrapper rings stuck with build up, will try some forte engine flush to see if they will free up before I take the more expensive option of rehoning.
Any one had any experience using these engine flushes?
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby AndyG » Fri Aug 31, 2012 11:23 am

What oil are you using :?:
Image
Ford Transit 120 TDI EPIC Automatic. 0-60 in a leisurely and smooth 12.7 seconds and 1/4 mile in 19.1 seconds. Now where's all these faster? manual Di s?
User avatar
AndyG
Site Admin
 
Posts: 27324
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:14 am
Location: West London

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Fri Aug 31, 2012 6:24 pm

10/40 semi synthetic Unipart. On the last oil change 2 months ago I tried a 15/40 mineral as I thought a slightly thicker oil may help, can't say that it made any difference.
Had one lovely lady customer who said she loved the smell coming from the exhaust as it reminded her of her childhood buying Ice Cream as a kid! :!:
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby AndyG » Fri Aug 31, 2012 6:42 pm

If it was me, I'd fit a (another) new set of valve stem oil seals and look into fitting them on ALL the valves if possible :idea: (as I think they're only fitted to the inlet as standard?)

Make sure that they are of the "cup" variety and not just an "O" ring

This used to cure the problem on the old Perkins 4/108 in most cases :)
Image
Ford Transit 120 TDI EPIC Automatic. 0-60 in a leisurely and smooth 12.7 seconds and 1/4 mile in 19.1 seconds. Now where's all these faster? manual Di s?
User avatar
AndyG
Site Admin
 
Posts: 27324
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:14 am
Location: West London

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby vanfox » Sat Sep 01, 2012 3:52 pm

If its had new pistons/rings the bores should have been honed already. Try giving it a good 50-100 mls run at 50 mph to run it in. Put it back on synthetic oil. Valve stem oil seals a good idea as well.

If it idles for a long time seems its a good candidate for 50-50% clean veg oil. Cleaner emissions and it'll cut your fuel costs, you could develop a second line selling fish and chips.........
vanfox
Transit Devotee
Transit Devotee
 
Posts: 1186
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:40 pm

mmm chips, Nah bad enough coming home covered in sauce! Live in Sussex so have taken van for several hard slogs over the downs.No Luck :(

Talked to an old school engine rebuilders locally and they near enough confirmed what Ivor Searle said that the barrels had probably glazed due to prolonged idling and engine temp not getting high enough. | think whatever solution its going to be its going to be expensive.

I shall get this sunny warm spell covered and when trade plummets I shall look at my options...my head says get the I.S engine looked at and wallet says breakers yard for 2nd hand engine. will let you know. Thanks
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby vanfox » Fri Sep 07, 2012 9:11 am

I'd go with proper valve stem seals, may be able to do them without lifting the head?

Try tying the EGR butterfly open. It'll be recircing exhaust all the time it's idling contributing to the smoke when you drive off?
vanfox
Transit Devotee
Transit Devotee
 
Posts: 1186
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby AndyG » Fri Sep 07, 2012 10:42 am

vanfox wrote:I'd go with proper valve stem seals, may be able to do them without lifting the head?
I'm pretty sure you can, just make sure the piston is up on the cylinder you're working on, as that's the way it was done on the Perkins (The Di of it's day :wink: )
vanfox wrote:Try tying the EGR butterfly open. It'll be recircing exhaust all the time it's idling contributing to the smoke when you drive off?

Absolutely :!: Excellent idea :idea:
Blank off the EGR system that's allowing the build up of unburnt fuel in the combustion chambers :!:
Image
Ford Transit 120 TDI EPIC Automatic. 0-60 in a leisurely and smooth 12.7 seconds and 1/4 mile in 19.1 seconds. Now where's all these faster? manual Di s?
User avatar
AndyG
Site Admin
 
Posts: 27324
Joined: Sun Mar 12, 2006 1:14 am
Location: West London

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby vanfox » Thu Sep 13, 2012 1:37 pm

Have you tried it? Does it work?
vanfox
Transit Devotee
Transit Devotee
 
Posts: 1186
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Thu Sep 13, 2012 10:24 pm

Sorry for delay in replying but sunshine has kept me busy :D Garage did replace with cup variety although have not checked whether they did the exhaust valves as well.
Egr valve is still blanked off and have tried tying back the butterfly valve as I know this is done on some ice cream vans at shows to cut down on smoke but this has had no effect on the blue smoke.
Reckon its got to be one of three things
1 The head
2 Oil seeping from oil channel to cylinder through leaking gasket
3 Oil ring

Since she puffs blue on start up after having a long run the evening before to get home and presuming that oil does not defy the laws of gravity and seep upwards past the ring overnight I think I will replace the head with another one I bought as a spare and see if this gets rid of the problem. Thanks for the suggestions Warbling toad
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby Guy88 » Fri Sep 14, 2012 11:05 am

try routing the breather into a catch tank rather than back into the inlet and see if it improves
2008 200 T350, LWB GLX,
1999 SWB low roof ex BT, officially rotten and awaiting restoration

REMAPPED BY http://WWW.VANTUNER.COM HE IS THE WAY FORWARD

LIVIN' LOUD

Image
User avatar
Guy88
Site Moderator
 
Posts: 16297
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 10:37 pm
Location: Banbury, oxon

Re: Ice cream van engine problem

Postby warblingtoad » Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:52 pm

Thanks for that one but no joy, still looking like major overhaul in winter.
warblingtoad
Newbie
 
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2012 8:27 pm


Return to Mk 3, 4 & 5 - Second Generation Transits



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 00353theking, chris72a