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What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads...

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What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads...

Postby eresseraca » Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:25 pm

Okay so I've searched around, lots of info and finally I found this thread: viewtopic.php?t=3968&highlight=fuel+pump+allen+key+turns

Which sums it up nicely! 8)

Though...


Question 1. Learning as I go here when it comes to engines so I do not know if it's a Bosch or Epic pump system. Need to go out and check! :mrgreen: . But if the pump in mine is a manual Bosch, then OK to go ahead and turn the pump up 1 full turn as per the thread above?

If it's an EPIC pump, then forget it right as it will give an engine fault light if I mess with it, correct?


Question 2. When it comes to the EGR mods I get contradicting info when searching, mine is a 2.5TD 100PS (1998). Can I blank (or mod as in thread above) the EGR on my turbo engine and does it give me any benefits?

If I can't do it on a turbo (which some posts seem to imply) is there any benefit only turning the pump up or will it cause or risk more smoke and higher consumption?


Question 3. Are these bullsh*t and marketing gimmicks or can this or similar "chip boxes" give any power increase to a 2.5TD
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Chip-Tuning-B ... 2687479155


Many thanks in advance for your knowledge and replies! :)
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby joinerman » Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:38 pm

If it's an epic you will have a large multi plug on the back of it with about a dozen wires going from it, you can't really do anything with it but you ca convert to a manual pump, lots to do then. :D
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:06 pm

Thanks joiner! That's what I kinda suspected from reading around. So first thing cleared then, if it's an EPIC I will let it be :mrgreen: it's working nicely as it is, but if there's a manual bosch and more to be had out of it :twisted: the other questions still stands 8)

Oh and even for an EPIC the link in question 3 is still stands!
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby MinorMatt » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:30 pm

Question 3 - don't waste your money!

There are a few things you can do - but not much
I'm experimenting all the time. It also depends what power output you start with
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95 M Prototype/Mule DRW 100PS Highcube
93 L GL Minibus
96 P 150 TD 100PS LWB Hi-Top

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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:44 pm

MinorMatt, thanks I kinda guessed that on question 3! :)

What about the inconsistency in information on EGR mods on the 100ps turbo... is it a good thing to do and would I get anything out of it... and is it possible in both scenarios, manual bosch or epic pump?
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby V184 » Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:51 pm

eresseraca wrote:Thanks joiner! That's what I kinda suspected from reading around. So first thing cleared then, if it's an EPIC I will let it be :mrgreen: it's working nicely as it is, but if there's a manual bosch and more to be had out of it :twisted: the other questions still stands 8)

Oh and even for an EPIC the link in question 3 is still stands!


i would try it, if its no good send it back !
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:19 pm

V184, maybe I should! :wink: ...30 day return policy anyways through eBay :mrgreen:
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby AndyG » Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:06 pm

What mileage has your van covered :?:
The chances are, your EGR valve stopped working a long time ago and the good news for you is that the design is such that it stays shut when not working.
Have look at the throttle body valve as soon as you start it up, you will see the lever pulsing back and forth while the ECU is trying to establish a feedback from the EGR valve.(both EGR and throttle body valves are on the same vacuum system) This soon stops indicating that there is a fault in the system (that can be ignored)
Your "engine" light will take a few seconds to extinguish after you start your engine, indicating a fault is stored in the ECU memory.

As for the Ebay item; I'm with V184 :!:

I'd expect the engine (or should I say exhaust) will smoke a bit with that on.

They also talk about waranty. Well if any of this model of van is still under waranty,.......................
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Ford Transit 120 TDI EPIC Automatic. 0-60 in a leisurely and smooth 12.7 seconds and 1/4 mile in 19.1 seconds. Now where's all these faster? manual Di s?
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:35 am

AndyG, many thanks!

The van and engine is all stock with 121.000km on the meter (75.000 miles), prior owner serviced it regularly according to the service book at qualified service stations.

From your reply I take it that EGR mods are in fact something that can be done on turbo engines then without having a permanent engine light? :wink:

I'll check the engine light and the lever if it pulses and then stops. If so then the mod is already there, haha! :) If it's still working though, then I could proceed with the mods according to thread right?

The eBay item, would be nice to try and just send it back if it doesn't do anything. I've heard people running chips on different brand diesel engines, some seem to benfit more, some seem to stay the same. When it comes to the black smoke, am I correct that black smoke essentially is unburned fuel?

So with chip installed, normal driving shouldn't introduce more black smoke than without (if so I could essentially dial a manual diesel pump down instead of up as it's providing more fuel than needed). Then when accelerating hard black smoke could potentially increase, this would be something to just accept and live with as at that stage there's unburned fuel "escaping" before the turbo catches up, turbo lag? Am I on the right track or all wrong? :D

I've also read (at least when it comes to Volkswagen/Audi engines, one can find a lot of info from tuning community on those :mrgreen: ) that you can get rid of some of the black smoke from a chipped VAG diesel engine by:

- Installing an induction filter instead of the normal boxed air filter.
- And blanking the EGR.

Is this just the tuners thinking it looks cooler with a coned filter or is there any truth in this statement?

PS: I read around here on the forum about getting a pretty big noise increase with a cone filter, so I'm not really gonna do that I think as I've tried to minimise cab noise already. BUT, would still be interested to hear whether the statement above with reducing black smoke is true!
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby MinorMatt » Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:22 am

eresseraca wrote:MinorMatt, thanks I kinda guessed that on question 3! :)

What about the inconsistency in information on EGR mods on the 100ps turbo... is it a good thing to do and would I get anything out of it... and is it possible in both scenarios, manual bosch or epic pump?


You won't get more power but it will stop the inlet getting more bunged up - use a plate not a restriction in the vacuum line
www.facebook.com/transitionclassics

Lucas Laser 2000 & IDS

95 M Prototype/Mule DRW 100PS Highcube
93 L GL Minibus
96 P 150 TD 100PS LWB Hi-Top

Gaffa tape is like the force, it has a light side, a dark side, and it holds the universe together
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:58 pm

Thanks! So I think I'll schedule a "tuning day" later this autumn then :mrgreen:

1. Get a new panel air filter to drop into the filter box.
2. Order the chip unit off eBay and try it out, return if no good.
3. Order or DIY manufacture a blanking plate for the EGR.
4. At the same time remove the EGR assembly to clean it out.
5. Haven't checked yet if Bosch or epic pump but I think I'll skip turning the pump up if keeping the chip on there, as both these options seem to have a potential increase of black smoke.

Some thoughts on my number 4, cleaning the EGR. I did run forte diesel and turbo cleaning products last month but I generally like the idea of tidying things up if I open them, even if thread I linked in my first post talks about not cleaning the EGR as there's a risk of loose gunk and soot continuing on to the injectors and possible clog them. But if removing the EGR valve completely when cleaning then this can be avoided I guess?

Or would one really need to remove and take the whole manifold to get it cleaned properly, I mean if there's the same amount of soot clogging the walls in there? Finding pics like this when searching on EGR cleaning makes me wonder how much effect your loosing... at least a lot of space lost where air could otherwise move unrestricted! (I hope mine doesn't look like that :mrgreen: )

Image
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:14 am

So had time to go take some shots of the engine today.

Engine01.jpg


Lucas pump, so won't be fiddling with that :wink:
Lucas01.jpg


EGR blanking questions

So to completely remove, inspect and clean the EGR valve. I'll loosen the bolts with red arrows, and then when putting back the blanking plate goes where the green line is, correct?

Yellow arrow, the hose... what's travelling in that one and a noob question but need to ask you guys. Is there any chance of getting air in the system where it doesn't belong if I remove the EGR completely to clean it? Also, does the hose just pull off the valve or is there some trick to that one. Connector for sensor on the top I presume, that one just disconnects as any normal electrical connector would?

EGR02.jpg


EGR03.jpg


Then I need to loosen that hose clamp down there to get it off (red arrow in pic above).

The clean the valve parts up, peek into the inlet to see how much soot is in there on the walls (decided I won't start with removing and cleaing that at this point), fit the blanking plate and put things back in reverse order.

Did I miss anything or get some step wrong? :mrgreen:
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby AndyG » Sat Oct 14, 2017 12:27 am

No chance of getting air in the system and the blanking plate proposal is correct too :)
Image
Ford Transit 120 TDI EPIC Automatic. 0-60 in a leisurely and smooth 12.7 seconds and 1/4 mile in 19.1 seconds. Now where's all these faster? manual Di s?
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby eresseraca » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:48 am

Blanking plate it is then, thanks for confirming that one! Gonna go ahead and order a new panel air filter at the same time.

Read some more on these plug-in tuning chips and I have to say I got a bit more skeptical... from what most people write they get bad reviews (not looking at any specific brand of them), but on many reviews and or discussions people state that they simply seem to increase fuel into the system, why it also would cause black smoke and not really do much to fuel economy or to HP and torque. But then again, when people here report improved performance of the 2.5TD when increasing fuel amount on the manual bosch pump then again this chip could do kind of the same thing to my EPIC system I guess...
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Re: What works on 2.5TD to increase power? too many threads.

Postby wobbles » Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:21 pm

hey my camper has the same 2.5td 100ps engine and pump , how did it go with the blanking plate installed ?
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