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1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Thu Apr 26, 2018 5:51 pm

Hi Riggard
Thanks for your advice that's really useful.
I've just spoken to the garage and they were very apologetic and said when they changed the fuel filter the second time they forgot to put the water in fuel sensor back on and they have it at the garage. They've offered to give me a genuine ford fuel filter and put the sensor back on for free. I'm taking it in tomorrow morning, a bit nervous about letting them near it again but hopefully if it's a genuine part it might fit better. I just want to get it back to how it was! If this was the problem all the time I'm going to be really mad that they got me to buy a new battery and charged me the labour to work out what was wrong with it!
Fingers crossed I have good news tomorrow.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:03 pm

Hi, Sam P.
I'm not sure that the car of your year of release has a fuel injection pump with a connection for removing air.
As in this photo.
http://transit-club.com/_fr/24/8706031.jpg
This choke is located on the horizontal axis of the picture on the left.
Photo of my friend Vova from Brest,Belarus, from the Russian language forum Ford Transit.
And I was there, but I was expelled from there.
Per politics.
The Vova screwdriver indicates the valve-regulator of the internal pressure of the injection pump.
If there is this choke, it has a 14-mm hexagon key, then twisting it in two turns and turning on the starter, you can see how the fuel pump exits the air or fuel.
If there is no such fitting, then it is necessary to unscrew all the nuts on the injectors for one turn and scroll the engine with the starter until the clean fuel without air and foam comes from under the nuts.
If the union is, then you still need to unscrew the nuts on the injectors and scroll the engine to clean fuel.
After that, tighten the nuts and start the engine.
The engine must start, but not immediately.
If no air is detected in the fuel, but the start-up remains poor, then it can be assumed that the initial injection time is incorrectly set.
Late injection. I need to release the four bolts on the injection pump pulley and turn the injection pump shaft clockwise.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:14 pm

If the fuel filter is incorrectly installed, the first thing that happens after starting the engine is the fuel leakage through the filter housing.
Simply, the capacity of the booster pump is several times greater than the motor consumes. The pressure of the booster pump is small, but sufficient-about 0.3 bar.
Fuel from the filter itself through leaks during installation can not flow-it is located below the interface of the filter with the housing.
The fuel can flow into the tank if the pump-leakage pump fails, both valves in it.
In this case, the pump will pump fuel from the tank to the filter with the engine running and when the engine is scrolling with the starter.
In this photo there is a choke in the center.
http://www.fordtransitclub.ru/_fr/1/9609650.jpg
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby davetheshrew » Fri Apr 27, 2018 4:19 pm

after you sorted this get a one way valve and a bit of diesel pipe and put the valve between the fuel pump and filter, that way there is always fuel in the pump with no place for it to escape. Done it to every transit ive owned, really helps.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:06 pm

Hi All
Just an update and thank you to you all for your help with this so far. Yesterday the garage fitted the correct fuel filter with the water in fuel sensor. And it was starting well until it had a night sitting and when I came to start it this morning it was struggling to get going again but it did start on one battery. It is still taking a while to fire though unlike before the parts were fitted and I don't think it is right. So I decided to check for air in the fuel and followed your advice cherniy_chack. I found the choke and undid the hexagonal bolt 2 turns, as I undid the bolt I could hear what I thought was air releasing. I started the engine and within seconds clear fuel was coming out. so I re tightened the bolt. The engine is starting now but the starter is still turning for longer than it used to before it fires up. I ran the engine for a couple of minutes and am going to leave it overnight to see how it copes in the morning. Can I assume as you say that it is the timing which is incorrectly set if it still struggles in the morning? In which case I will take it to a diesel mechanic I have found for a second opinion.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:58 pm

Hi All
Another update, I left the vehicle overnight after it had it's new fuel filter and it won't start at all now. I even tried it with 2 batteries. Again it is trying to turn over but just not firing. I have booked it in with a diesel mechanic but they can't look at it until next week. They say it sounds like a timing issue. I'll report back when we've solved the problem.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Keef » Tue May 01, 2018 8:48 am

Wonder if the garage adjusted the valve clearances when they did the cambelt but used the rule of 9 by mistake??
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby steverk » Tue May 01, 2018 11:45 am

I have done 2 belt changes on my 2.5DI in the last 10 years and found that there is scope for a degree or 2 of retardation even when using accurate pins to lock the various engine components during timing. On the last fitting I did the weather was cold and the engine was reluctant to start and misfired for several seconds. I re-checked the timing (it was correct) but deliberately applied holding force on the pump pulley to ensure it was advanced within the limits of the retaining pin.

Re-started the engine and it fired up perfectly. The van can sit for literally months in the garage and always starts immediately.

I believe that the numerous cold start problems that MK5 owners have are a result of the timing being just a little bit retarded
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Tue May 01, 2018 3:25 pm

Now, the heat and incorrect setting of the injection moment has little effect on the start-up of the FT diesel.
Sam P removed air from the fuel system and the motor started faster.
How air gets into the system, that's the question!
I do not think that the reason for the incorrect installation of the fuel filter.
I think it's just a coincidence.
So the stars are located in the sky ...
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Fri May 11, 2018 10:57 am

Hello everyone,
Just wanted to let you all know that my motorhome is now starting well and is back to it's old condition. I took the motorhome for a second opinion to a diesel specialist and they advised me that the timing was slightly out and I should take it back to the original garage. The original garage then paid my second opinion garage to reset the timing and so far since I've had it back it's been starting very well so I've got a good feeling that it has all been solved and we're back to where we started. So I certainly didn't need a second battery. Can look forward to our holiday now. Thanks again to everyone for your advice.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Fri May 11, 2018 2:04 pm

I am amazed at the qualification of British diesel mechanics. :(
Have set the wrong timing, late injection, and the entire English-speaking world is looking for a problem. And even one Ukrainian ... :lol:
The first thought that appears with a bad start after replacing the timing belt is an incorrect injection setting.
I could not imagine that there are mechanics who do not know this. :(
I'm glad that you found and eliminated the reason for the poor start-up of your engine.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Fri May 11, 2018 3:37 pm

Thanks Cherniy_chack, I am also amazed that a mechanic has to employ another mechanic to do his job for him. I think I just picked the wrong mechanic in the first place but I have to say the guys who sorted it out are my heroes so you know, one bad apple doesn't make the whole crop bad. One good thing from the whole experience is that I've learnt a lot more about my transit so that can't be bad.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby joinerman » Fri May 11, 2018 7:03 pm

And emptied your pockets, lol
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby Sam P » Sat May 12, 2018 8:16 am

Yeah there's the small matter of the money they charged me for a new battery i didn't need and the extra labour to find out what was wrong with it (as if they didn't know!). But that's next week's battle.
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Re: 1995 2.5 diesel starting problem

Postby cherniy_chack » Mon May 14, 2018 5:29 pm

Knowledge is expensive.
You have to pay.
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