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Constant crank seal woes

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Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:20 pm

Hi guys,

First post but this transit connect is my first ford and is currently making me pull my hair out.
I come from a background of VAG cars so used to design and ways things are done being a little different
Anyhow with a job change on the horizon, I need a smaller van and managed to get a very late 2013 mk1 LWB transit connect
Did a bit of reading up a saw the usual wetbelt advisories flagged.
Van had just hit 120k so did all the usual servicing and used the LYMM wetbelt to chain conversion kit (come across wetbelts once in machinery I fix and they were less than crap)
Borrowed the timing tools but not plate alignment tool to do this, after reassembly no surprise the crank seal leaked
Then purchased another seal set and the alignment and timing tool set. Fitted all properly and torqued to autodata but still leaked.
Went to ford and bought a genuine crank seal. Locked the flywheel and buzzed pulley off and replaced seal but then leaked again.
Quickly hopped in the car and thought must be pulley, bought another and fitted with the ford seal that just leaked and again it pours out.
Pulling my hair out with this thing and seriously getting to the point of setting it on fire somewhere, been off the road more time than its been on since I bought it
Any body got any ideas or help???
Cheers
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Boghopper » Sun Feb 25, 2018 10:17 pm

Hello,

You need to align the timing chain, case cover with the crankshaft using a special aligment tool, you have done this? If you don't align the timing case cover to the crank it will leak everytime.
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby mk2dk » Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:48 pm

Hi Ronin225
As Boghopper writes, you have to align the cover with the crankshaft, but If I understand your thread correct, you did align it, using the special tool. When I changed mine, Ford told me it was important not to lubricate the new seal, it has to be assembled dry.
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:21 pm

Cheers for the replies guys.
I do have the alignment tool so made sure the plate was sitting central to the crank
Ive always lightly lubricated lip seals, etc so maybe this where ive gone wrong.
Have also been told today after fitting the seal and installing the pulley to leave it for roughly 4 hours allowing the seal to relax into position
Undecided yet on whether to do a full strip down and just make sure the casing is 100% aligned or just put new crank seal in dry and leave it for the evening and try starting it the next day?
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Boghopper » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:44 am

So, you are undoing all the short, M6 bolts that hold hold the timing cover on? For you to loosen the timing cover correctly you will need to remove the cambelt and the fuel pump/timing gear gasket. Behind this gasket there are some more bolts that are only accessable once the gasket has been removed. If you are replacing your crank seal and using the alignment tool without slackening all these bolts then nothing is going to be able to be realigned as it is still bolted.

Image

The bolts that need to be slackened are behind this gasket. These bolts not only retain the gasket but also act as timing cover retaining bolts. They have studs coming off the head for M6 nuts to go on.

Image

You can see the studded bolts near the fuel pump sprocket in this photo. This is after the above gasket has been removed.
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:46 pm

Thanks for the guidance, I have watched the video guide as well which was helpful.
Since I aligned the cover last time I was hoping to initially just remove crank pulley and install new seal but completely dry this time and allow it to settle in place for a few hours
If this fails ill have to change the above pump seal and case gasket again and strip down to as you say slacken the casing off but id rather not do all of that for the third time
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby john3022uk » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:01 pm

make sure you use the small bolts x3 the ones near the pump seal when putting timing cover back as if you use a longer one it pushes the seal away and allows it to leak as i had this problem awhile back
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:43 pm

Hi john,
That is an interesting thought, so three shorter bolts around the oil pump?
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby john3022uk » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:48 pm

no when you put plastic timing cover back on the bolts around the diesel pump area
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:01 pm

Injection pump seal has been fine and remained dry, issue is with the lower seal where the crank pulley goes through
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:50 pm

Just a quick update, fitted crank seal number 4 and left overnight to set into place, no surprise when started it poured out.
So ordered another complete seal set and did a full strip down. Borrowed all the tools from the ford garage too, spent ages constantly checking the cover alignment whilst torquing it down
Anyway after all this and fitting the seals dry and leaving it overnight to relax into position I started it and all seemed dry.
Drove to work and all fine, got into it today and smelt a hot oil after I stopped, looked under to see oil everywhere
So fed up with this vehicle its unbelievable, wish Id never bought it.
Going to ring ford in the morning and see if they can look at it now as ive run out of patience. After ive had the expected enormous bill i'll be getting rid, if a simple cambelt causes this many problems any future issues are bound to be as horrific
unfortunately first and last ford for me
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Boghopper » Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:00 pm

That's really depressing. I know how you feel. I seem to be fixing things on mine all the time lately. Where does the oil weep from, the timing case seal housing, or where the where the crank comes through the seal? If it is weeping from the centre, then either your crankshaft has wear on it and is tearing the lip of the seal or there is runout on the crank. The seal seemed to work for a while this time but then prematurely wore the seal causing it to fail. I cannot see what else it could be, unless you have some massive oil pressure causing it to fail. Have you examined the old seals to see if they are tearing on the centre lip?
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby mk2dk » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:16 am

Hi Ronin225
I fully understand your frustration.

Could the leaking be caused by a blocked crankcase ventilation ?
When I bought my Connect, the oilpan had rustet through in one corner. The hole was the size of a needle point, but oil seimed to be everywhere on the engine.
Hope you find a solution
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Ronin225 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:10 pm

Thanks for the replies guys
Ive not checked the breather system apart from the ones off the rocker that were removed to install timing plate. Whats the best way to check breathers?
This current time I'm not sure where the oil is coming from but previously it has been from the centre of the shaft where the crank pulley goes through, it seems to seal to the housing but not like the spinning pulley. Being as the crank doesn't protrude much it appears the seal on seals on the pulley
I have booked it into ford however they are very hesitant to even look at it, so really not holding much hope
The only other thought I have had is that the sprocket that comes with the chain kit isn't machined square and when the pulley is bolted up against it it causes the pulley to be angled which could make it spin eccentrically?? just an idea
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Re: Constant crank seal woes

Postby Boghopper » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:27 pm

Yes, that is correct now I think back. The seal actually seals onto the crank pulley and not the crankshaft. Have you taken a look at the pulley and the actual shoulder on the pulley for scoring/ roughness to see if it might be tearing the seal?

Was the timing chain kit genuine Ford, or one of Ho-Chi-Min's imports? Might well be a poorly machined lower sprocket as you say.

What does the pulley look like when the van is running? Can you see any obvious runout?

I have booked it into ford however they are very hesitant to even look at it, so really not holding much hope.


Tossers! They tend to abandon their vehicles once the warranty has run out.
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