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Injectors failing symptoms?

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Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:49 pm

Hello guys. 04 plate with 185k on original injectors but started to occasionally misfire - especially when cold - and can be a bit "fluttery" at even speeds below 45 mph. Under acceleration load it all goes away and smooths out and tends to run OK when warm and doing above 60 mph. No engine management light and no codes logged so;

If injector(s) are starting to misbehave, what are the initial symptoms?

Thanks.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Graham Taylor » Tue Mar 27, 2018 10:04 am

Can be smokey from cold start and runs a bit rough until warms up. Eventually if you dont replace engine will start to cut out, may restart straight away for a time.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Kenton » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:27 pm

Exactly the same here for 3 years. Starts on the button, always blue smoke, can sometimes be horrendous amounts. Instantly embarrassing. Engine doing the same as axxeman's; misfires quite a bit and feels jerky on gentle acceleration with noticeable clack, but once warm, purrs like the proverbial kitten. On similar mileage @ 133k. Reading Axxemans post a final time, and i have very similar symptoms! Thanks for the enlightenment there Graham, any chance you could elaborate a bit for us? This has been a proper bug bear of mine since i have had the van, but short of booking in with a diesel specialist and paying probably over the odds, i would love to get to the bottom of this! The van has a new set of glow plus, clean air filter, recent MAF sensor,recent engine block temperature sensor, recent oil and filter, recent fuel filter, AND had had a few bottles of good old Redex treatment, plus being run on expensive Diesel. I have tried to look for this topic, but not yet found such a good reflection of the problem i have. Cheers and kudos to Axxeman for posting this.;)
Last edited by Kenton on Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Graham Taylor » Tue Mar 27, 2018 8:32 pm

TDCI do a leak off test. If you do a search on here lots of info on how to do it yourself. If you don’t fancy it shouldn’t cost much at a garage.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Wed Mar 28, 2018 12:32 am

Logic, (and copious research since I made the opening post), leads me to suspect one or more injectors being partially blocked or failing to open correctly. Anyway, I have got hold of a set of refurbished that have not done many miles and I am going to get those put in on Friday. See if that cures it.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby ned » Wed Mar 28, 2018 7:53 am

When did you guys last change your fuel filters, a blocked filter can cause all sorts of issues. N
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Kenton » Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:51 am

Mine was done about 6 months ago, didn't change anything. @ Axxeman, i would be very interested in finding out how you get on with the refurbed injectors mate.
2005 T230 LX 90 TDCi LWB
ST 17" alloys
Focus ST170 seats
Fiesta Zetec S/W & G/K
Mondeo Inner Door handles & vents
Sport spoiler
Blacked h/lights
Side bars
Facelift rear lights
Lined/carpeted
Lowered on Gaz kit
110 intercooler
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Remapped
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:47 pm

ned wrote:When did you guys last change your fuel filters, a blocked filter can cause all sorts of issues. N


Every 10 000 miles - sometimes a tad before if the nasty glow plug light makes an appearance. It's plenty especially as I run mine on "home brew" and not pump diesel ...
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Wed Mar 28, 2018 8:49 pm

Kenton wrote:Mine was done about 6 months ago, didn't change anything. @ Axxeman, i would be very interested in finding out how you get on with the refurbed injectors mate.


Yeah, I will report back. I have to go 50 odd miles as my go-to guy is an hour away but £25/30 hr makes up for it AND I get a fair old test run on the way home after stuff has been done.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Sat Mar 31, 2018 1:35 pm

Unfortunately, nothing more to report as yet ...

Went to my spanner man yesterday, he fitted new set of injectors (ebay; used) and coded them in. And then spent nearly two hours trying to get it to start. No joy. Nothing. Nada. At this point he took them back out and put my old ones back in, re-coded them, and she fires up immediately. So looks like I got sold a duff set of injectors for which getting a refund looks like it's going to be "fun".

Bought another set from different seller and will try those when they arrive.

Three hours and 108 miles wasted thanks to the seller. Made my piss boil.
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Svb1780 » Fri Apr 13, 2018 5:34 pm

I guess injectors are a silly price at Ford? I just called them reference glow plugs and the wanted Almost 900££ 700 for glow plugs including labour... Oh Dear!
I have the same symptoms white/blue smoke at start up from cold!!!
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Kenton » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:49 am

Looks like this will continue for us!... I would rather do an engine swap than pay more than the engine as a whole is worth for new injectors!... Completely stumped with this problem, and have been for over three years now :(
2005 T230 LX 90 TDCi LWB
ST 17" alloys
Focus ST170 seats
Fiesta Zetec S/W & G/K
Mondeo Inner Door handles & vents
Sport spoiler
Blacked h/lights
Side bars
Facelift rear lights
Lined/carpeted
Lowered on Gaz kit
110 intercooler
De-Cat
Remapped
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby Kenton » Fri Apr 20, 2018 10:20 am

Any more news on weather new injectors solved the issue Axxeman?
2005 T230 LX 90 TDCi LWB
ST 17" alloys
Focus ST170 seats
Fiesta Zetec S/W & G/K
Mondeo Inner Door handles & vents
Sport spoiler
Blacked h/lights
Side bars
Facelift rear lights
Lined/carpeted
Lowered on Gaz kit
110 intercooler
De-Cat
Remapped
User avatar
Kenton
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Sat Apr 28, 2018 1:59 pm

Kenton wrote:Any more news on weather new injectors solved the issue Axxeman?


As you can probably guess, there's not much to tell since the last update, but here it is;

Sent the set of injectors back after buyer refused to take them and eBay intervened. Eventually got refunded. Bought another set from a different buyer who sent me four that looked OK but two had the codes missing or illegible! They have also been returned and I got my money back yesterday. So, this time I have gone to P F Jones and bought from a reputable company. I got two refurbished injectors and hopefully I will get them fitted sometime next Monday (30th). I could only afford to get two at once (£108 ea) but there is an £18 charge on each which is refunded when you send your old ones back. Still ninety quid each mind you! My guy will do a leak back test first and change the two that appear to be needing it most. Then I will get another two next month and change the remaining pair. Van is still like lumpy custard until it warms up.

I hadn't forgotten about this thread but there just hasn't been much of value to relate ... except buying from eBay "experts" is a minefield. Sure £200 is good for a set of 4 but not if you have to keep sending them back over and over! Grrr.

Greg
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Re: Injectors failing symptoms?

Postby axxeman » Mon Apr 30, 2018 5:05 pm

UPDATE MONDAY APRIL 30TH 2018

OK, so I went to my man in the Cotswolds today to try and improve the "splutteryvan". First we tested the injectors one by one, in situ, by connecting a small clear tube on the spill nipple into a clear plastic 600 ml bottle. We ran the engine on tick over for a (timed) 2 minutes per injector. The results were;
#1 Pipe dripped slowly and delivered 10ml
#2 Pipe dripped faster and there was 20 ml in the bottle
#3 Same as #2 with about 25 ml expelled
#4 Ran much faster and there was circa 50 ml after the test (plus the pipe was dripping where it connected to the injector), so was about 70 - 80ml in reality.

As I had only two new injectors, we changed cylinder #3 and #4. This meant that the fuel pipes for #1 and #2 could be left undisturbed. We coded all four into the ECU and tightened all the unions ...

Van started first crank, tick over was noticeably smoother and more regular and on the 50 mile drive home I noticed that;
1. Acceleration was more positive.
2. Van did not lurch if you let the speed drop without changing down, (i.e. 35 mph in 5th).
3. Van ran quieter.
4. Pulled much better up steep hills - even accelerating in 5th.
5. Ran perfectly smoothly when holding a steady speed in a 30 or 40 zone, (flutter had disappeared).

I will get another two next month and complete the job but so far, I am more than pleased. Be interesting to see what it starts like from cold later this week ... will update again when I know more.
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