Adblue light straight away on ignition on

[metalworker0]

BTW .i said i wasn't certain - . AI disagrees and says it is a NTC (Negative Temperature Coefficient) sensor... which works on resistance

google:

failure modes of NTC (Negative Temperature Coefficient) sensor.

still, this individual sensor may be available on ebay for a couple of pounds


all the best.mark

[Ryan9153]

i had a feeling the temp sensor was within that heater unit that why i said buy one of those heaters ..

TESTING - it may be this way --- i'm not certain
first you need the wiring digram to work out the colours of the wires

nowa days temperature sensors work in a peculiar way. they are called K-TYPE THERMOCOUPLES

from wiki
A Type K temperature sensor, also known as a thermocouple, works based on the Seebeck effect, which creates a voltage when two different metals are connected and exposed to a temperature difference. In a Type K thermocouple, the metals are Chromel (nickel-chromium alloy) and Alumel (nickel-aluminum alloy). When these metals are joined, and one junction is exposed to a temperature gradient (a temperature difference), a voltage is generated, proportional to the temperature difference. This voltage can be measured and correlated to the temperature using standard calibration tables or electronic devices.

ive delved into this before

so answers .. my own from a while back

First check continuity between the two wires of the thermocouple. If you have continuity it's probably fine. Usually they are either good or bad, but in rare cases they can be compromised by corrosion or something. To check if it's accurate you'll need a voltage meter than can read millivolts. Put the leads on each wire of the thermocouple. At 32*F the voltage across them will be zero. As temp increases the voltage goes up. 70*F will be .843 and 1000*F will be 22.251. I'll attach one of the standard voltage/temp charts for type K.

chart

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/atta ... download=1

chart is mind boggling --- like a bus time table for the whole of a county....im sure a simplified one can be found

so basically your BCM knows what these voltages are for given temperatures .. and it does the maths


the thermocouple may be available for a couple of pounds on ebay


AND first though ... as with all of these mind numbing electronic faults, see first answer about disconnecting battery for 15 mins, and making sure all your electrical system .. battery voltage , earths are up to scratch

all the best.mark

Again thanks Mark it’s a great help, I’m still a little confused as today, I disconnected the whole loom of the adblue tank to see if I got an open circuit fault code for the temperature sensor, but I got no fault code generated for the adblue tank temperature sensor. I got loads of fault codes for adblue heater circuit, adblue level sensor, pressure sensor, vaporiser, etc etc but no fault code for the temperature sensor so I’m a little confused about this temp sensor voltage at the moment. I’m wondering if it’s a software, RCM issue? More investigation needed I think bud, wish I could get hold of diagrams to find out for def where this temp sensor is, will do the battery disconnect tomorrow bud thanks.

[metalworker0]

all guesses here , i cant see the sensor from here .. for all i know, it may not be a sensor but it may be a bi-metallic switch that turns off the heater ... i dont know as would mean watching hours of youtube videos. or buying one and taking it apart

i suspect even ford techs don't know what's inside and they commonly replace the whole tank.

from my armchair , i'm not much use .

im looking , i'm sure i left a link here in the past to someone dissembling one and fixing it somehow

edit ... cant find it .

all the best.mark

[Ryan9153]

Ok so update today, disconnected battery for well over an hour and still exactly the same, same warnings as soon as I turn the ignition on and same 6.55 volts on live data for reductant tank temperature sensor. I’m lost at mo but will keep investigating.

[Ryan9153]

Does anyone know if the adblue modules are straight swaps if I get same part number or do they need programming to the vehicle, I’m talking about getting a second hand one and just trying to see if that’s where my voltage is coming from.

[metalworker0]

will look for 1 hour tonight to see if i can get some sort of video

you've not plugged forscan into it to read the code, have you?

the manufacturers part number off the heater would go a long way to me delving and finding out things

all the best.mark

[Ryan9153]

Hi guys so have scanned it with Forscan and no fault codes with that, I spoke to the well known Oreillys and they tend to agree that it’s either a software or ecu issue, it’s why I’m looking into swapping the adblue module, but I need to know if it’s a straight swap or I will need to program it to the car or even if it can be done and what’s involved?

[Ryan9153]

will look for 1 hour tonight to see if i can get some sort of video

you've not plugged forscan into it to read the code, have you?

the manufacturers part number off the heater would go a long way to me delving and finding out things

all the best.mark

Not sure what you mean there are no dtcs with any diag, Forscan, thinkcar, launch etc tried them all. Will find part number for adblue heater unit when I can, thanks Mark.

[metalworker0]

On the USA models of transits amongst other fords, there was a recall for adblue faults, 2015 - 2019, after the parts are replaced they needed a software upgrade., note: they call adblue DEF

The engines in the USA are often V6's ... that does not say that the adblue tanks are not the same as yours.

They have recalls in USA, because they complain more and get lawsuits etc .. does not happen here .. so no recalls here . as far as i know

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbEdr6Q6cKw


Could not find any info on fixes . other than complete tank replacement or heater replacement ... the guy in the above video looks into the heater, makes a few comments .. and we are non the wiser on how things work.


search words .. not all at the same time

DEF , adblue , reductant heater , ford , faults , fixes , fix , temperature sensor ,

all the best.mark

[metalworker0]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwmF-c6TZpQ&t=571s

posted wrong link

[Ryan9153]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwmF-c6TZpQ&t=571s

posted wrong link

Hi bud yes seen that video before a few times, I have no fault codes in either the PCM or RCM, however that part has been changed, I’m looking into the software now to see if I can use for scan or thinkcar to check for updates, I have also bought an exact same adblue module secondhand to see what a swap entails, so will keep this post updated as I try things.
Thank you bud.

[Frag]

If you have no fault codes present but it’s still counting down to no start,you may have actually fixed the fault,but the no-start inducement will not clear until the PCM / REDCM see a ‘clear pass’ of the system operating.
This usually involves a specific sequence,each different depending what triggered the initial countdown.
(Slow and fast heal faults)
Some also involve a very specific drive cycle,if your running out of miles before ‘no start’ it won’t cut out,but may not restart if stopped (turn stop start off anyway if fitted)
Another app (in FDRS anyway) allows you to clear a 0 miles / no start,and gives around another 30 miles reset to let you drive and clear the fault inducement.

[Ryan9153]

If you have no fault codes present but it’s still counting down to no start,you may have actually fixed the fault,but the no-start inducement will not clear until the PCM / REDCM see a ‘clear pass’ of the system operating.
This usually involves a specific sequence,each different depending what triggered the initial countdown.
(Slow and fast heal faults)
Some also involve a very specific drive cycle,if your running out of miles before ‘no start’ it won’t cut out,but may not restart if stopped (turn stop start off anyway if fitted)
Another app (in FDRS anyway) allows you to clear a 0 miles / no start,and gives around another 30 miles reset to let you drive and clear the fault inducement.

Hi bud and that’s for the reply, interested to know what these slow fast heals are because the ford specialist told me something like that and he said take her for a 30 mile drive and the adblue light will go out but it never did. Also I still have this 6.55 volts reading on the reluctant tank temperature sensor. Whereas the other same engine adblue system ones that I have checked only read around 1.3 volts on this sensor at tickover.

[Frag]

Regardless of voltages,if there is a fault on the tank temp sensor circuit,you should have a DTC for it.
If you cleared all codes and then did a roadtest,it would either log a dtc for if there’s a problem you’ve not fixed,or come out of inducement.
It’s not just a case of driving for 30 miles though.
It’s a very specific warm up,idle,drive at 2000 rpm,and then like 70kmh in 5/6 gear for 15 mins (IF it’s an efficiency fault that is)
FDRS,when reading DTCs,it then shows any slow or fast heal faults so you can see what’s causing inducement.
These can also be seen in datalogger.
But again,there are multiple FDRS apps to clear each cause of inducement,so whether it was a boost / turbo fault,EGR fault, efficiency fault,or MAF fault,the drive cycle is different…..

[Ryan9153]

Regardless of voltages,if there is a fault on the tank temp sensor circuit,you should have a DTC for it.
If you cleared all codes and then did a roadtest,it would either log a dtc for if there’s a problem you’ve not fixed,or come out of inducement.
It’s not just a case of driving for 30 miles though.
It’s a very specific warm up,idle,drive at 2000 rpm,and then like 70kmh in 5/6 gear for 15 mins (IF it’s an efficiency fault that is)
FDRS,when reading DTCs,it then shows any slow or fast heal faults so you can see what’s causing inducement.
These can also be seen in datalogger.
But again,there are multiple FDRS apps to clear each cause of inducement,so whether it was a boost / turbo fault,EGR fault, efficiency fault,or MAF fault,the drive cycle is different…..

My only problem with that logic is that I disconnected the whole adblue tank connector to see what faults came up and none came up for the tank temperature sensor, heater circuit faults came up, tank level sensor a,b,c but no tank temp sensor. Because this is one of the first adblue systems on this minibus it may be the temp sensor doesn’t come up with a fault code, I don’t know at the moment it’s a mystery. Next week I’m linking to FDRS to see what can be done that way. I spoke to Oreillys who seems to be an expert on these and he said he thinks it’s either a software,update issue or ecu error along those lines. He even hinted at maybe someone has tried messing with the programming which I can’t confirm or deny as it’s now been to so many places, one garage had it for 3 months and still no fix.