X reg Fuel leak UPDATE

[chrisuk]

Hi and 1st time Im posting on here.

I have a fuel leak and after doing a "under the van" move with a bright torch it seems to be comming from the pump, I am a HGV macky by trade so I dont see a problem if its a relatively easy job but I had a chat with my local Ford stealer ship and Im not happy with what they had to say about it all, turns out that the solenoid seal goes on te pump which seems to be a CAV type, not sure of make though so... or as he says where the seal goes in it could be corroded so a replacement pump would be needed (I smell commision somewhere) but to cap it all off he says if it is the seal they have to replace the whole solenoid which comes with the seal, surely this cannot be true, flip "O" rings are everywhere, was quoted around £200 and said it was a 3 hour job, all I could see if the starter motor is in the way, engine type from what I can see is DI and its a turbo ( I think they're all are), its a medium wheel base, medium roof, rear wheeel drive and it aint for sale as I see they are well sought after.
The van is not being used on a commercial basis..yet, I like the van and still feels very solid with 132000 miles on the counter.
Cn you also tell me if its correct to use 5W30 oil in this engine cos I'd like to go the semi synthetic oil route and is it corret that oil only needs changing at 15 000miles, though I intend to replace at every 10 000 miles from here on

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated

Thanks

Still no joy, apparently there might be a problem with supply of a recon unit from Ford, anyone know if there is a problem, I was also thinking of getting a 2nd hand unit but I doubt the Ford garage would approve of installing it, whats your thoughts on this, loks like a biggish job if I do it myself, the bugger is I dont have the time but possibly I might do it on a weekend and the other problem Im concerned with is the electrics on the pump, doesnt this all need to be set up via a PC once all is done and dusted, what would happen if I started it up after installing the pump form another van from a breakers...
your input would be appreciated

[MrMPuk]

Can't help with the pump but the oil is okay, Ford state 12000 miles for service though so you should be okay.

[dan@dsfplumbing]

Though imo more regular changes would be best. Mine was last done at 51,000 miles with nice clean semi-synthetic stuff (and filter). I checked it the other day and it was seriously black and lacking any consistancy. Totally used up !!!!

And this is at less than 60000 miles. i wouldn't subject the van to another 4,000's of that slop in there.

F1 autocenters does a full service for the 2.5d for £89 which is where mines headed next monday morning


As for the pump surely it's not a sealed unit. Any consumable part could be replaced such as a poxy seal ?????????

[Nighthawk]

Can you give any other details on the van? An X plate can be one of two models.

I'm a little confused as to whats going on.



The EPIC pumps made by lucas have solenoids to control pretty much the entire pump, thats over £200 with out doubt as it's a CAV dealer job only.

Current Transit is having a bit of a problem with a couple of areas depending on variant, thats where the extra details come in real handy.


Re the oil change interval

Current Transit is 15000 miles or 12 months what ever comes sooner
95 series Transit on an X plate was 12500 miles/12 month

[madmark]

i cant run my vans for that long for a oil change ! i would do it every 6 minimum but if you were useing it for work then i think it would have to be longer without change ,like 12500

[chrisuk]

Can you give any other details on the van? An X plate can be one of two models.

I'm a little confused as to whats going on.

According to the registration details this is what it is: TRANSIT 350 MWB TD, on the 2 front doors it just says TRANSIT, it is rear wheel drive, hope that helps.

Thanks

[Nighthawk]

Right then, if it's an X on the current shape then it's a Bosch pump.

The only solenoid I can think of that could possibly be leaking on the back of that pump is the timing solenoid. There is a kit to allow that to be changed by a skilled person which costs around £45+vat.

It looks like a white circle directly below the injector pipes and above the rear support bracket.

It's a repair covered by a TSB and even a recall on some of the later vans, book time is between 2.7 and 3.0 hours to replace it. It's a bitch of a job too.

If the leak is higher up than that, your looking at a repair by a pump specialist as Ford don't supply any other parts for the Bosch pumps.

[chrisuk]

It's a repair covered by a TSB and even a recall on some of the later vans, book time is between 2.7 and 3.0 hours to replace it. It's a bitch of a job too.

If the leak is higher up than that, your looking at a repair by a pump specialist as Ford don't supply any other parts for the Bosch pumps.

Thanks for your reply dude, What do you mean by TSB... something or another "service bulletin" I assume... Having had a look at the leak its not easy to determine where the leak is from, we all know how diesel can run up and all over the place so Im not sure where its comming from which is a bugger, Im just a bit concerned that it may not be worth repairing the solenoid leak and waste +£200, then spend another £700 on a pump, that alone means I could pick up a good lowish mileage engine complete, what would be the best way to determine if it is just the seal on the solenoid, if it is just the o ring would you know what the dimensions are, this is going to be a job Im going to tackle myself, is there any special tips I need to know, ie: remove starter motor etc, I will in the meantime order up a decent workshop manual for the Tranny.

Thanks so far.

[MrMPuk]

Techanical Service Bulletin.

[Nighthawk]

The T is for Technical

I favour a UV dye in the tank and then running it for a day or so, then if you shine a UV lamp on the area affected the leak will be visable. failing that your taking the inlet manifold off and the starter off to have a good look at whats wet and whats not.

Old TIS cd's have been on ebay for ages, but the ability to replace the injection timing solenoid in service is a recent repair, so it's only on eTIS which you can't access.

The only way you can get the o rings for this solenoid is as part of the new solenoid and it's a crucial part.

If you do it your self it's going to cost around 60quid inc vat,

Starter off
Inlet manifold off
rear pump support bracket off
Solenoid off

The tsb says to remove the oil cooler, but i've done loads of them and never had the cooler off.

The job involves a cut and shut on the cables, but the solenoid comes with the correct connectors too. If your going to do the solenoid i'll talk you through it step by step.

The inlet manifold can be removed in around 15 mins so you can have a good look at the back end before you decide which way to go.

[chrisuk]

Glad to hear you've done a few of these, is it possible that where the solenoid goes in the pump that it may be corroded as the dealer has told me, have you had any where this was the case as he said a few have had this problem, my only down fall is I'll have to do it in this bloody weather BUT because of it I may still change my mind but to the regret of my thin wallet
If I do change my mind I would really appreciate your input what workshop manual is a good one to go for or do you know where I can get a copy/Cd from..

Thanks

[chrisuk]

Been a few days, got a phone call from stealer ship and told me its not the solenoid valve seal but on the back there is a centre section and its leaking out there, they reckon new pump would be the right course of action, total cost for the job is £1195 also said they have to put on new injector pipes, sorry but this is something new to me, I have done loads on diesel engines in the past from HGV's to big V12 Cats, replace injector pipes, you must be having a laugh, if it was a bit warmer I'd do it myself but I dont have a garage so doing it outside is going to be a killer, if only the weather would improve a bit, still Im thinking save yourself some hard earned dosh and do it yourself, possibly it might pay to cut out some boardnig and palce it on the sides to prevent the wind chill factor if you know what I mean, what do you guys reckon and where is the best place to get parts for the injector pump, tips on engine position would be appreciated as to insider tricks, I was told they have to re programme the unit once its been removed, is this true, if so then how come when I replaced the battery there wasnt a problem.
Thanks in advance
Chris

[Nighthawk]

Right m8, your dealer is not talking bollox m8.

The central section you mention can only be repaired by a Bosch diesel agent, and that costs almost the same as a reco pump.

The pump DOES need to be programmed, the pump has it's own control module on top of it (FPM) and this needs to be able to communicate with the powertrain control module (PCM), The reprogramming gets the codes for the PATS in place.

Ford DO specify that the injector pipes are replaced each time they are undone, this is because of the risk of leaking if re tightened. A retail cost of around £75 for the 2 pipe sets is a little though

You could do the pump yourself, but you'll need to get hold of a couple of special tools.

Flywheel locking peg, to ensure NO1 piston stays exactly at 50 degrees before TDC
You'll also need the tool for removing the front plate blanking cover...it's the same tool as used for replacing the front crank seal.

And lastly, there is a very important set of tools with hold the injection pump drive sprocket in position........because this job is done without touching the timing chain.

The allowed time for a dealer to do this job on the RWD transit is
3.7hours to remove and replace the pump with a further 0.5hours to connect WDS and initialise the diesel system.

Last time i looked the retail cost of the reman pumps was

580ish for a Bosch repaired item (dealers can't use these for warranty repairs) and 635ish for a full reconditioned pump.

A new pump is on the thick side of 1.3k

[chrisuk]

Excellent, just what I needed to hear, nice to see that its been backed up by you on this issue, once its fixed it up for sale as Im not interested in hassles like this with a van , seems like todays cars/vans/bikes are going back in reliability, years back things would last a lot longer compared to todays so called modern machines, what is going on that things are breaking and not lasting yet we see no action against companies that produce money gobbling problems, an I lead to believe that where once I was pro bosch for all their electric I need to rethink, does it look like the like of Bosch have got to big for their boots and needs a wake up, guess their shareholders are the ones that are linning their pockets at the expense of us, its all to do with price its madness and I urge others here to stay away from the new shape trannies, I was also told now that the trannies are getting older they are producing these sort of problems in big fashion, so much so there is at least possibly a 2 week waiting list fot the exchange pump, my only problem with this is now is the exchange pump going to produce the same problems any time soon after its all done and dusted, Im going to e-mail Bosch about this, I'll keep this up dated for all to see.
Thanksf or your input, kinda re assures me Im not being ripped off as is usually the case in todays world.

Cheers

Chris

[Nighthawk]

As much as i'd like to blame the likes of Bosch and LuK and Valeo for all the current Transits problems, I can't

Much of it comes from poor design and penny pinching imho, the vehicle was designed by americans for the american market, Ford's poor financial situation at the start of the decade gave way to parts being specked to a cost......although i'm sure the powers that be won't admit that!!!!

Transit is actually more reliable NOW than it was 3 or even 4 years ago, and it'll only get better as the next face lift was done by people who know Transit

The pump you buy from either a ford parts dealer or a diesel agent will be covered by a 12 month warranty.