Epic programing

[Catman47]

Hi all

I have fitted a replacement pump on my Y reg 2.5 TD Ford Transit motorhome. All timing procedures ok ….New water pump…..New Cambelt…aux drive belts etc. Does the replacement pump have to be programmed or not.???? i have fitted a new lifter pump and crankshaft sensor
also a genuine Ford fuel filter etc etc but still no start……fuel is going to the pump but nothing to the injectors.

Can anyone help please ……..it’s giving me an EPIC headache. Thank You in advance.

[MinorMatt]

The injection pump itself has no coding.

I have had this in the past - admittedly I didn't spend too long trying to bleed it through but ended up changing the pump again to get it going

Was the cambelt all pinned up correctly?

[Catman47]

The injection pump itself has no coding.

I have had this in the past - admittedly I didn't spend too long trying to bleed it through but ended up changing the pump again to get it going

Was the cambelt all pinned up correctly?

Hi MM
Thank you for your quick response…..I have a good diagnostic guy (25 + yrs experience) is going to interrogate the system using …..
Forscan. Yes timing was done correctly by locking crankshaft at back of engine…….pegged the fuel pump pulley….and pegged the camshaft pulley before new cam belt fitted and tentioned. EML never came on when engine running to indicate logged codes but did come on when key was switched on and extinguished as normal after a few seconds.

Checked all male multiplug pins on pump for backing off damaged or corrosion but all good… My hunch is the ESOS valve is either open in closed position or power feed to it is missing??? I don’t know how to safely check this.

Hope you or any one else can help and would be much appreciated.

[MinorMatt]

The light should go out immediately - if it stays on for a few seconds there are minor fault codes (EGR for example) which don't affect how it runs, or historic major faults which haven't cleared.

The ESOS on the mk5 pumps runs on a PWM signal, it opens and closes rapidly to control diesel flow through the pump. If you remove the plunger it won't run. If you put 12V on the coil pack it won't run AND you might blow the coil.

What is the history of the pump you have fitted, and if the EML wasn't coming on why did you change it?

[Catman47]

Hi MM
When problems first started was during the Covid lockdown I just ran the engine now and again as was advised. I committed the cardinal sin by not checking fuel gauge and she conked out. This is the first diesel vehicle I have owned so did not know that big problems can occur if this happens. Then filled up via Jerry cans.
I called in my mechanic who bled the system…….checked all fuel pipes were not leaking and she fired up and run sweet. We then fast forward to the night before my booked MOT where I took her for a run down to fill up the tank then a fewr runs along a duel carriage to blow the cobwebs out……..She ran fine so parked up overnight…….next morning MOT day she just refused to start…..flattened my battery .

Mechanic comes out again bleeds the system… and she refuses to fire up ….only cranks………mechanic said bad news it needs a new injector pump. Taking his word I assessed a used pump taken off a working Transit and the uk company said it was being shipped from Germany.

Bad news for me £600.00!!!!!!!!!!. So on arrival I fitted said pump, Cambelt, water pump drive belts. etc. Sorry for the book MM Lol.
After completion we still had the same problem ie ….crank…….no start ….and no fuel to the injectors.
Personally I think it is a problem with the ESOS valve maybe not getting a live feed or it’s fubard.

Finally after checking all fuses I have a Relay tester device and out of seven I tested only one is showing a green light and the tester is cycling the relay with the green light flashing. The other six are showing a red fault light.

Forgive the long ramble MM but I felt giving you as many facts as possible ……..this may help you with any advice you may offer.

[MinorMatt]

It sounds to me like your mechanic was taking the "parts cannon" approach. I.e. throw everything at it to see what makes it work.

I can pretty much guarantee it won't be the stop solenoid - the only real failure mode for that prevents it from stopping. And whats the chances of 2 pumps having an issue?

Do you have an immobiliser LED? On a Y reg it should be on the LHS of the dash more or less below the radio. Whats it doing?

You have tested 7 relays and only 1 works? There are only 2 relays in the entire system and (assuming you have an immobiliser) if they are faulty the van won't crank over. One of these relays is in the engine bay.

Quite often in diesel tanks there are floating dreggs which will get sucked up and block the filter, and if a vehicle has been left and water has got in the tank you can get "diesel bug" which forms a black slime in the diesel which will block fuel filters.

Its difficult without having the van in front of me - but I would start with a fuel filter change, and look at the contents of the old one, then I would be taking the feed pipe to the pump off, cranking over and checking diesel is getting to the pump.

Whereabouts are you anyway?

[V184]

Has the new fuel pump got the same serial number as the old one ?

[Catman47]

Hi MinorMatt

I wish the the van was in front of you also…………I live in Newport Gwent. You are definitely the Man with your knowledge and Laser 2000 scanner .All the relay’s mentioned are from the under dash fuse box………..the one that is working is the “Power Hold Relay” you mention in one of your other post’s.
I tested the 7 relays with a tester that you plug them into ie 4pin or 5pin socket and press a button which shows …Green for good……and Red for fail……also if green light is illuminated it will test cycle the relay by on/off switching . I would like to test them using my multimeter but not confident on how to do this ??.
I think the fuel contamination seems likely because it all went after filling the tank with Diesel. The filter was not changed by my mechanic because he assured me it was Ok. I have got a new Ford one so that will be going on definitely.

I have recently bought a Diesel Fuel Master Syringe which will bleed the system and allow fuel to be checked through the clear body.
Bought online from USA……..clever tool.
Thank You MM for your suggestions……..will keep you informed of the progress…M8

[MinorMatt]

Get a jam jar, and drain some of the fuel from the filter in to it so you can see what it looks like? There is a knurled drain nut on the bottom of the filter

[Catman47]

Hi MM

Yes I will do that……….I can draw some from the tank with my new master syringe. I think you are correct in thinking the fuel maybe suspect especially after I had foolishly allowed the fuel tank to run empty.

There can be all types of crud and gunge floating around. If this proves to be the case how do you suggest I proceed to correct this.
Will I need to flush the tank out?? and will I have to clean or change the injectors?? I am so grateful that you are helping me …cheers M8

As I have always done when fault finding my Vauxhall Calibra Turbo is to think back to what I did just before the problems started.
Thank You.

[Catman47]

Hi Mm

Got an update for you…….my mobile mechanic and his mate came out this W/end…..we. confirmed that some relay’s had gone faulty. We are going to change those relays of course but after they probed the Epic pump multiplug we discovered we had no power feed at all …..hence ESOS valve not working obviously.

After part removing passenger side dash to get access to ECU low and behold ….no power also to it. We found evidence of vermin droppings and some chewed loom so we must have a live feed to the ECU from the fuse box has been compromised. We just need to find the break in the circuit……..replace the relays and fingers crossed she will fire up.

Have you ever come across this type of problem before???. Have to wait until Monday when I have an auto electrician coming over to trace the faulty harness etc and fix it.

This has been a right pain in the A** to say the least .!!!

[Noctule]

Hello

After part removing passenger side dash to get access to ECU low and behold ….no power also to it. We found evidence of vermin droppings and some chewed loom so we must have a live feed to the ECU from the fuse box has been compromised. We just need to find the break in the circuit……..replace the relays and fingers crossed she will fire up.

If it is a relay or fuse then the one most likely at fault is in the fuse box just below and left of the injector pump. If you pull the fuse in there you can't start it.

Mat

[MinorMatt]

there is no live feed from the fuse box (except ign on signal to ecu). Power comes direct from ths fuses between the wing and battery.

[Catman47]

Hi Matt

Auto electrician came out today and sorted out the electrics and other problems. He found a faulty relay in the fuse box near to pump in engine bay the exact one you mention…….we then had power to ECU and power feed to pump. He connected up to diagnostic scanner and cleared a few codes and got all electrics working ok.

He discovered a sealing rubber O ring on the feed pipe to the pump was faulty and replaced that and bled the fuel system with a hydraulic pump. After checking with quick start she fired up but we now suspect the ESOS valve could be faulty and needs a new one ……I will remove it tomorrow.

We may refit the original pump that we know was working fine until the electrics, relays, etc went mental. Seems that the mechanic wrote off the original pump before a full check of electrics mentioned above.

Lastly Matt I have heard that the timing needs to be advanced on the pump sprocket for a Turbo engine…..is this true.
Thank You so much for all your guidance thus far

Kind regards

[MinorMatt]

Hi Matt

Auto electrician came out today and sorted out the electrics and other problems. He found a faulty relay in the fuse box near to pump in engine bay the exact one you mention…….we then had power to ECU and power feed to pump. He connected up to diagnostic scanner and cleared a few codes and got all electrics working ok.

He discovered a sealing rubber O ring on the feed pipe to the pump was faulty and replaced that and bled the fuel system with a hydraulic pump. After checking with quick start she fired up but we now suspect the ESOS valve could be faulty and needs a new one ……I will remove it tomorrow.

We may refit the original pump that we know was working fine until the electrics, relays, etc went mental. Seems that the mechanic wrote off the original pump before a full check of electrics mentioned above.

Lastly Matt I have heard that the timing needs to be advanced on the pump sprocket for a Turbo engine…..is this true.
Thank You so much for all your guidance thus far

Kind regards

The ESOS itself doesn't fail.... but the seal on the end of the plunger does, meaning it will not switch off (well runs on for 10s before its switched off in a different way). Do not put 12V to the solenoid or you will cause it and/or the ECU to fail.

Advancing the timing is only for fitting a bosch pump to a TD engine, so isn't relevant to you.