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Bleeding the fuel system

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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby andz327 » Sun Feb 28, 2021 4:35 am

NoMovinMunky where in the country are you ??
Did you try what mr Loot said ???

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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Sun Feb 28, 2021 5:57 pm

andz327 wrote:NoMovinMunky where in the country are you ??
Did you try what mr Loot said ???

ANDZ



I’m up north in Leeds and Yeahh I had them in a jug of diesel, had the proper connector to click into the feed pipe with hose going into the jug and hose going from the quick connect of the return above the front sensor into the jug, tried cranking for about 20 seconds on its own then tried with easy start a few times n just uses what I’ve sprayed in then dies and that was with the exact same parts that I had on the other day when I managed to keep it running briefly
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby loot » Sun Feb 28, 2021 7:35 pm

Ok so while in the bottle that means the only thing in the fuel system is the pump, injectors, cam/crank sync.

The scv/prv and o rings are the weak points.

The fuel pump sucks fuel from the tank to it then pressurises fuel to the fuel rail.

You have glow plugs in the system on mk7 which helps with cold start and emissions but I don't think they would stop the engine from running.

So the live data you need is for timing sync and pressure desired and achieved.

The scv and prv should be from ford in this case which costs in the region of 250+at a guess these days.

If the injectors are good and you're sure there's no leaks then there's not much left to stop it running.

Can you confirm that it does under some conditions fire using fuel from the injectors?
56 350 2.2 130ps mk7 with 2 side doors 8)
65 290 2.2 125ps custom with 2 side doors 8)
07 350 170ps
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Sun Feb 28, 2021 8:40 pm

loot wrote:Ok so while in the bottle that means the only thing in the fuel system is the pump, injectors, cam/crank sync.

The scv/prv and o rings are the weak points.

The fuel pump sucks fuel from the tank to it then pressurises fuel to the fuel rail.

You have glow plugs in the system on mk7 which helps with cold start and emissions but I don't think they would stop the engine from running.

So the live data you need is for timing sync and pressure desired and achieved.

The scv and prv should be from ford in this case which costs in the region of 250+at a guess these days.

If the injectors are good and you're sure there's no leaks then there's not much left to stop it running.

Can you confirm that it does under some conditions fire using fuel from the injectors?



I had the injectors out and tested back in November/December and I was told 1 was slightly over fuelling and they repaired it so I’m fairly confident the injectors are fully functioning

The pump that got put on I was told 2 week ago when I seen the guy that it definitely worked n came off an engine where the bottom end had gone

I’m almost certain it’s gets cam/crank sync. I’m guessing the cam sensor is the plug under the prv?

But Thursday when I took those videos it definitely ran on diesel but using easy start to get it running which is the first time it’s run since October when the issues started, which I’m sure now was down to the crank sensor. But after making some progress and getting it to run and idle on Thursday I’ve now gone back a step to not been able to get it run and idle on fuel, it’ll go for about 1 second which I’m certain is only what I’ve squirted in it
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby loot » Sun Feb 28, 2021 8:54 pm

I bought a mint turbo that was fooked :(

Although I've very rarely seen a faulty fuel pump on these, it's always the prv and scv. But that said it would have to be very severe to act like yours.

Put it this way, if the fuel rail pressure was correct and the injectors being told to inject and the cylinder compression correct then it should fire.

I've had bad injectors causing similar and they were coughing and spluttering etc. I've had a new but cheap clone prv that caused it, if it passes fuel then the rail can't build enough pressure to start properly.

I would even suggest fitting old prv and scv that work just to help diagnosis of this fault.

You could also blank the egr valve to be sure. I've had 1 that the grub in the body disappeared and it left a hole that stopped the egr working and was also stuck open.

If you can get a noid tester on the injectors it'll show if they are being energised, that's if you can't confirm it runs on fuel.

The system can turn off injectors of it has reason to. So a case of discounting things.

Get live data too and look at engine parameters.
56 350 2.2 130ps mk7 with 2 side doors 8)
65 290 2.2 125ps custom with 2 side doors 8)
07 350 170ps
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Ids v86 licence + v86.04 update + xprog here
Ids map here
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby andz327 » Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:30 am

Ok I MUST HAVE MISSED THE REPLACING OF THE PUMP IB THE LIST ..... are you sure the pump is located into the camshaft properly?
Put your old pump back on,
When your turning it over and crack open a fuel pipe i take it there's no pressure?

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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby andz327 » Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:30 am

That doon south to me mucker but I've been up an down the M1 a lot in last couple of weeks and could've dropped in for a laugh eh i mean a look see, I've got some mot work to sort out on auld B but should be back on road in a day or two and first time I'm down the east side I'll give you a shout if your still fooked
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:42 am

andz327 wrote:That doon south to me mucker but I've been up an down the M1 a lot in last couple of weeks and could've dropped in for a laugh eh i mean a look see, I've got some mot work to sort out on auld B but should be back on road in a day or two and first time I'm down the east side I'll give you a shout if your still fooked



Once this is sorted I’ve got some to do for my not that ran out in November lol but I did notice when I had it running the other day I noticed when the wheels are straight, if you turn the steering wheel to 11 or 1, if you go past it feels like it’s catching and has a fair bit of resistance and there’s a big old clunk but once you’re past it it’s smooth again and going back to straight is smooth so that feels like it’s gunna be a pain in the arse :(

I’ll be honest, I would assume it’s times correctly but I couldn’t say for sure, I’m guessing it’s behind that little plastic cover on the front cover? How hard is it to change the pump over? I’ve never done it before
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:55 am

loot wrote:I bought a mint turbo that was fooked :(

Although I've very rarely seen a faulty fuel pump on these, it's always the prv and scv. But that said it would have to be very severe to act like yours.

Put it this way, if the fuel rail pressure was correct and the injectors being told to inject and the cylinder compression correct then it should fire.

I've had bad injectors causing similar and they were coughing and spluttering etc. I've had a new but cheap clone prv that caused it, if it passes fuel then the rail can't build enough pressure to start properly.

I would even suggest fitting old prv and scv that work just to help diagnosis of this fault.

You could also blank the egr valve to be sure. I've had 1 that the grub in the body disappeared and it left a hole that stopped the egr working and was also stuck open.

If you can get a noid tester on the injectors it'll show if they are being energised, that's if you can't confirm it runs on fuel.

The system can turn off injectors of it has reason to. So a case of discounting things.

Get live data too and look at engine parameters.



Well yeah that’s true, I’ve bought countless things new that are shagged so I’ll give you that one

And with the egr, I’m pretty sure it’s already been blanked ‘cause when I got the van back the first time there was a sheet in the back with a blanking plate sized piece missing and a rusty outline of one next to it but again I’ll have to check

I did try changing from the new prv to the old one and when I undid it it hissed at me so I’m guessing there’s at least some pressure behind it

I’ll get some data today before I go finish wrapping a kitchen for someone and try see if the pump is timed right
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Mon Mar 01, 2021 2:19 pm

Right so I’ve just been out to check the pressure and it’s not getting anything, the cam/crank sync turns to yes when I crank and stays like it until I stop and the crank reference signal output is no fault. That’s with original parts on that it was running on last week on that video. And I’m sure I seen Thursday it was getting around 500-600 psi on the key without easy start
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby knobby1 » Mon Mar 01, 2021 8:33 pm

speedmunky wrote:Right so I’ve just been out to check the pressure and it’s not getting anything, the cam/crank sync turns to yes when I crank and stays like it until I stop and the crank reference signal output is no fault. That’s with original parts on that it was running on last week on that video. And I’m sure I seen Thursday it was getting around 500-600 psi on the key without easy start


500-600psi is nowhere near enough....The Mk7's idle with ~230bar (~3335psi). The PCM will not open/operate the inectors until the fuel rail pressure is at least optimal for running.

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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby andz327 » Tue Mar 02, 2021 1:57 pm

Have you checked pump drive is located properly in camshaft yet?? If ok put your original pump back on instead of the second-hand one you fitted

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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Tue Mar 02, 2021 6:10 pm

andz327 wrote:Have you checked pump drive is located properly in camshaft yet?? If ok put your original pump back on instead of the second-hand one you fitted

ANDZ



Not yet, what is it exactly that I need to be looking for? I never fitted it you see, somebody else did so I’m unfamiliar with what I’m looking for

Also, I’ve got a genuine ford scv coming as well and going to get a prv as well
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby speedmunky » Fri Mar 05, 2021 6:18 pm

A little update, I put the ford scv on with a ford prv and still no pressure but now it’s coming up with a camshaft code p0340. Been told to check the timing which I’m going to do next week sometime when it’s not so cold out
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Re: Bleeding the fuel system

Postby loot » Fri Mar 05, 2021 6:28 pm

If you see sync when cranking it means that the camshaft and crankshaft sensors are firing at the same time.
Although I don't know if a tooth out would do it?
56 350 2.2 130ps mk7 with 2 side doors 8)
65 290 2.2 125ps custom with 2 side doors 8)
07 350 170ps
[img]http://[/img]
Ids v86 licence + v86.04 update + xprog here
Ids map here
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loot
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