White/black smoke won't rev 135 T350 2.4TDCI

[Airthies]

Mine is a 2005 T135 RWD.

I thought the Duratorq engines were used up to 2006, and the Puma engines started from 2007.

I say "Ultimate" because before the TDCi engines, there were the DI engines without common rail injection.

Here are some photos of the engine.

How did you time the crankshaft in this picture?

The fuel pump doesn't actually need timed as it's a common rail system. It's purely a high pressure pump delivering the same fuel pressure to all injectors rather than to each individual injector at a certain point.

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[metalworker0]

I see Airthies
You are saying he could have had it timed wrong when taking the pictures and coming to the conclution it was out by 4 teeth.

I think that setting tool for the crank is needed for this operation otherwise you can go wrong.

and info saying point the holes in the crank at the oil pump (other post and youtube video)could also be wrong.
i was looking today at sets-ups for timing and on some engines with the diesel pump sprocket,on some the tensioner device has a different mounting area an inch away from where excudo's tensioner was.

all the best.mark

[Airthies]

I see Airthies
You are saying he could have had it timed wrong when taking the pictures and coming to the conclution it was out by 4 teeth.

I think that setting tool for the crank is needed for this operation otherwise you can go wrong.

and info saying point the holes in the crank at the oil pump (other post and youtube video)could also be wrong.
i was looking today at sets-ups for timing and on some engines with the diesel pump sprocket,on some the tensioner device has a different mounting area an inch away from where excudo's tensioner was.

all the best.mark

There are differences between engine size and generation across all of the puma family.
All basically the same but at the same time not cross compatible.
The TDDI is different from the TDCI
The 2.4 is different from the 2.2
FWD is different from RWD


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[Excudo]

Before removing the front timing cover, I cranked the engine several times on the starter. It's also very possible that the previous owner attempted to tow-start it, so the engine definitely rotated with the timing chain already stretched and the cam timing out.

While cranking, I had someone operate the starter as I listened carefully to the engine. There were no abnormal mechanical noises at all—no indication of piston-to-valve contact, valve train damage, or any internal component failure.

Once I removed the timing cover, I found the timing chain badly stretched and the tensioner fully extended, with the cam timing clearly out. After reading through the workshop manual and several Transit forums, it seemed the correct repair was to replace the complete timing drive rather than just fitting a new chain.

So I installed a complete timing kit, including a new chain, hydraulic tensioner, guides and sprockets where required, then locked the crankshaft and camshafts using the proper timing tools and set the timing exactly to specification.

After reassembly, the engine fired immediately on the very first crank.

[metalworker0]

i dont know, when you put that confusing picture up of it supposedly out of time with the tensioner showing unextended, and no crank setting tool on it .what are we supposed to think

all the best.mark

[Excudo]

Of course, this photo was taken the first time I removed the timing cover. I wanted to show the 4-tooth misalignment on the intake camshaft.

This photo was taken after I retimed the engine. The coloured links on the timing chain don't line up with the timing marks because I didn't take a picture the first time. I removed the timing cover again later to check that the timing hadn't shifted after the first engine start.

[metalworker0]

The coloured links are for doing it the first time .. it takes lots of complete revolutions to make those links line up again, ive done a quick search .. and i cant find anyone who has bothered turning it and counting the turns .. so must be quite a lot... they probably gave up at 10

all the best.mark

[Excudo]

Yes, exactly. I did the same thing and gave up after a few revolutions.

Looking at the photo, if you shift the whole chain by two links anticlockwise, you can clearly see that the coloured links line up correctly with the timing marks.

[Excudo]

As promised, I got back from holiday today and received the compression tester to check the compression on each cylinder.

I carried out the test through the injector ports, which also allowed me to check the movement of the rockers and valves on the intake camshaft.

Here are the results:

Cylinder 1: 365 psi
Cylinder 2: 350 psi
Cylinder 3: 325 psi
Cylinder 4: 380 psi

What do you think? Cylinder 3 is a little low, but I don't think that, on its own, this compression reading could cause that much smoke.

I also took a slow-motion video of the camshafts turning while cranking the engine. You can clearly see that everything is moving as it should. However, there is a huge amount of play in the journal at the timing chain end of the camshaft. I don't think it is possible to post a video directly on the forum.

If anyone is interested, I can share the video so you can have a look and give me your opinion.

[metalworker0]

Think your compression test passes .. don't worry about that

There have been reports on here of the camshaft carrier cracking .. which i suppose would give you the huge amount of play you mention.

Cant find pictures here .. although ive seen them

Anyway, if so, bad news - the cylinder head and cam carrier are a matched pair and you can't replace one without the other, as cylinder head and cam carrier are line bored together.

all the best.mark

[knobby1]

As promised, I got back from holiday today and received the compression tester to check the compression on each cylinder.

I carried out the test through the injector ports, which also allowed me to check the movement of the rockers and valves on the intake camshaft.

Here are the results:

Cylinder 1: 365 psi
Cylinder 2: 350 psi
Cylinder 3: 325 psi
Cylinder 4: 380 psi

What do you think? Cylinder 3 is a little low, but I don't think that, on its own, this compression reading could cause that much smoke.

I also took a slow-motion video of the camshafts turning while cranking the engine. You can clearly see that everything is moving as it should. However, there is a huge amount of play in the journal at the timing chain end of the camshaft. I don't think it is possible to post a video directly on the forum.

If anyone is interested, I can share the video so you can have a look and give me your opinion.

Post the video onto youtube and put a link to it here..!

Lord Knobrot (Smithy)

[Excudo]

https://youtube.com/shorts/J7EKBiiOEP4? ... SGNooB3vQ-

[Airthies]

https://youtube.com/shorts/J7EKBiiOEP4?is=qCq3ljSGNooB3vQ-

Why is the inlet cam shaft loose? It's not.

What you're seeing moving is the rocker shaft. Your camshaft is underneath making the rockers (silver bits) move.
There's bolts along the length of that shaft to hold it down fixed against the head. The cam shaft is below rotating and each cam moves one rocker.

As has been suggested previously if the cam was 4 teeth out on the timing, the piston has smacked the valves and forced them up forcing the rockers upwards.
The weakest link is the rocker shaft bolts and their fixings.

Because it's loose the inlets aren't opening properly, therefore not enough air getting into the cylinder, hence poor combustion as over fueling for the volume of air and the reason for smoke and poor performance.


I suspect either stripped bolts or the aluminium mounts in the head for the rocker shaft have snapped

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[metalworker0]

The video - yes i see a rocker midway down the right hand side barely moving at all , this needs to be investigated

Are hydraulic adjusters on these .. perhaps its not pumping up otherwise what Airthies says

Close scrutiny of each rocker required .. magnifying glass if you have poor eye site.. they bend, then crack and then snap. or the fixings break ..not sure if this engine has cam lobes that can break loose on the shafts .. rockers may have hair line cracks that are hard to see .

Looking at the parts diagrams .. the video suggests its a 2.2 .. as the 2.4 has another section on top of the rockers that prevents you seeing as much of them
others will put me right on this.

4 teeth out or not .. if new to engines, i wouldn't have had the balls to play around with something as complicated as this one .. most of us here built up our knowledge of engines slowly .. first working on perhaps 2 stroke bike engines .. then 4 cylinder push rod engines in cars of the 70's.. so gradual not strait in on something that is way beyond understanding for a novice .

all the best.mark

[Airthies]

what Airthies says

FIFY

Looking at the parts diagrams .. the video suggests its a 2.2 .. as the 2.4 has another section on top of the rockers that prevents you seeing as much of them
others will put me right on this.

It's a 2000-2006 2.4 TDCI you can tell by the cast rockers and fixed rocker shaft.

Later models of 2.4 and 2.2 have rocker ladders.

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