2.2 puma - smoking under load - turbo? [pics]

[ulik87]

Hi!
Ever since I've had the van it ran OK. starts first time, seems to have enough power (for 100BHP), runs rather smoothly. Had an annoying problem of a bit of a smoke soon after startup which clears after a minute, then while warm it's ok BUT drops a significant cloud while accelerating as soon as turbo kicks in (it's not so obvious during the day time, I only see it in night time when there's a car behind be, I can see significant cloud in their lights reflection). Replaced all injectors as they were first suspects. No change whatsoever checked sensors, checked EGR inside - some soot but just thin layer, no gunky carbon build up or anything of that sort. So after checking and doing all that I decided to check the turbo. First removed the exhaust pipe to see the turbine, it was dry and fairly clean. so took the compressor's hose off...and I saw quite a bit marks of oil. On the inlet pipe to the compressor it's a bit damp but seems like no significant amount of oil. What's interesting is that the shaft has close to none axial play I was expecting the turbo to be completely knackered, blowing oil while under load, but now I'm not too sure. Is it possible you think? If that's not it THEN WHAT?! the smoke comes out only under load about when turbo kick in. Also if I rev it when stationary up to about 3krpm and hold it, it'll start smoking too (noticed that only recently). Any suggestions. I'm shitting my pants a bit it might be piston rings but wouldn't it smoke constant blue smoke it that case?
was thinking for a moment it could be open EGR while accelerating, but I've got no error codes whatsoever. When I was refitting it after the check up, I plugged it in and actuated it using diagnostic interface and it seemed to work fine.
Oh, I checked the oil return pipe from turbo and it's absolutely fine, no restrictions no gunk. clean.

here's a few pics

compressor outlet:


compressor inlet:


turbine out (note there seems to be slight dampness behind the turbine?):


that's how the EGR looked like:

[andz327]

Hi!
Ever since I've had the van it ran OK. starts first time, seems to have enough power (for 100BHP), runs rather smoothly. Had an annoying problem of a bit of a smoke soon after startup which clears after a minute, then while warm it's ok BUT drops a significant cloud while accelerating as soon as turbo kicks in (it's not so obvious during the day time, I only see it in night time when there's a car behind be, I can see significant cloud in their lights reflection). Replaced all injectors as they were first suspects. No change whatsoever checked sensors, checked EGR inside - some soot but just thin layer, no gunky carbon build up or anything of that sort. So after checking and doing all that I decided to check the turbo. First removed the exhaust pipe to see the turbine, it was dry and fairly clean. so took the compressor's hose off...and I saw quite a bit marks of oil. On the inlet pipe to the compressor it's a bit damp but seems like no significant amount of oil. What's interesting is that the shaft has close to none axial play I was expecting the turbo to be completely knackered, blowing oil while under load, but now I'm not too sure. Is it possible you think? If that's not it THEN WHAT?! the smoke comes out only under load about when turbo kick in. Also if I rev it when stationary up to about 3krpm and hold it, it'll start smoking too (noticed that only recently). Any suggestions. I'm shitting my pants a bit it might be piston rings but wouldn't it smoke constant blue smoke it that case?
was thinking for a moment it could be open EGR while accelerating, but I've got no error codes whatsoever. When I was refitting it after the check up, I plugged it in and actuated it using diagnostic interface and it seemed to work fine.
Oh, I checked the oil return pipe from turbo and it's absolutely fine, no restrictions no gunk. clean.

here's a few pics

compressor outlet:


compressor inlet:


turbine out (note there seems to be slight dampness behind the turbine?):


that's how the EGR looked like:

What year is it and whats the mileage, any oil around injector seals??????
And any diesel van at darko'clock will look as though its smokin looking in yer mirrors mate

ANDZ

[bambi mk 1]

No smoke without fire no fire without smoke Is it your first diesel

[ulik87]

I took the turbo apart. seems like there's oil behind the compressor impeller. I've got an impression it's leaking through the shaft. the sealing ring on the compressor side seems OK. when I was taking the compressor side apart, some oil spilled out of the housing (the outlet)...
this smoke is visible during day time when I rev the engine up to some 3k when stationary. It's got a bluish tint. It's not that regular diesel puff in the night time. It's a proper cloud. I can't see nothing much wrong with the turbo itself, like any excessive play, or wear to the shaft, no scoring, but I was surprised by the amount of oil in the housing and the fact there was oil behind the compressor impeller. I think I'll order a new cartridge and I'll see if there's any change. Maybe I'll give mine to specialist to take a look and refurb if needed.

ps. are the pictures visible for you guys?

just in case, here's the album with all the pictures.
note the dark circle inside the copressor housing, that's oil. same on the plate behind the impeller and on the back of the impeller itself....looking at all the parts, I think I might get away with only replacing the seal on the compressor side?

LINK TO THE PHOTO GALLERY BELOW
https://photos.app.goo.gl/v7QHexkXdK9FmThg7

[v8dave]

I can't see the pictures.

If you take the oil filler cap off while the engine is running does it blow out oil ?
Does it blow oil out of the dipstick hole ?

[bambi mk 1]

Is it using oil

[ulik87]

I can't see the pictures.

If you take the oil filler cap off while the engine is running does it blow out oil ?
Does it blow oil out of the dipstick hole ?

it does splash with oil, yes. there's also some fumes coming out, but it doesn't pressurise, the breather is functioning properly I think.
there's no oil coming out of the dipstick hole, no fumes neither.
injectors were replaced, copper washers are intact.

Is it using oil

I think it uses a bit, but not excessive to be fair. I don't use it much, it's a camper conversion. I think I topped it up to 4 dots out of 5 on the dash and I made some 300-400 hundred miles and it dropped to 3 dots.

[bambi mk 1]

The smoke in the mirrors is normal for a diesel thats why the tree huggers are up in arms .

[ulik87]

The smoke in the mirrors is normal for a diesel thats why the tree huggers are up in arms .

I wouldn't be pointing it out if it was normal amount. Plus, you're missing the point it's also present while revving it while stationary. If I keep it at 3k rpm it'd blow constant bluish smoke.

have you seen the pictures?

https://photos.app.goo.gl/v7QHexkXdK9FmThg7

[v8dave]

If the turbo was leaking oil from the compressor seal I'd expect intercooler to have oil sitting in the end tanks.
Is the inlet tract wet with oil ?
Is the inlet manifold between the egr connection and the head wet or dry ?

As Andz327 asked earlier, what year and how many miles.

Were genuine ford injector seals used or just "copper washers" ?

Splashing oil out the the filler suggests a compression leak.

[ulik87]

If the turbo was leaking oil from the compressor seal I'd expect intercooler to have oil sitting in the end tanks.
Is the inlet tract wet with oil ?
Is the inlet manifold between the egr connection and the head wet or dry ?

As Andz327 asked earlier, what year and how many miles.

Were genuine ford injector seals used or just "copper washers" ?

Splashing oil out the the filler suggests a compression leak.

was so busy with removing the turbo I didn't get to removing the intake hoses to check, but after seeing the amount of oil marks on the outlet of the compressor side, I was quite sure there would be oil in there. the point where the egr pipe goes into the inlet is damp with oil. that raised my attention, hence the whole operation with the turbo. the inlet before the turbo is rather dry. there's no much spill from the breather itself. I don't think it leaks constantly. To me it looks like it's an initial stage. As if it was drawing oil only when the turbo picks up, but I might be wrong. should there be so much oil behind the impeller and around it inside the housing, but not much oil traces in the turbo inlet?
this is 07 plate, 160k on the clock.
regular copper washers supplied with the injectors but they're sealed. I can tell the difference
oh...forgot to mention, that's a peugeot boxer engine, so the filler is positioned almost flush with the cam cover so it's rather splashing from cams not from pressure as there's none. saying that, there are obvious exhaust gases, I'm not arguing with that

see the picture. the oil filler doesn't have the neck tube as transit has

[edit] sorry, I think I had the RWD transit in mind? I'm sure I saw a transit with raised oil filler but not sure if all of em have that

[v8dave]

In my experience once the turbo leaks noticeable oil from the compressor end it fails very quickly.

If the engine has 160k on the clock then it's probably compression blowing past the the piston rings if the injector seals are good.

Other thing I notice is you appear to have taken the compressor off the turbo ?
How are you balancing it again ?

[andz327]

In my experience once the turbo leaks noticeable oil from the compressor end it fails very quickly.

If the engine has 160k on the clock then it's probably compression blowing past the the piston rings if the injector seals are good.

Other thing I notice is you appear to have taken the compressor off the turbo ?
How are you balancing it again ?

I was just about to tell him to bin his turbo , seeing that
"mr Injectors are sealed... i can tell the difference" has split his turbo apart ....unless he's got turbo dyno balancer
......
Buy a new turbo cartridge as your rebuild will fail if you don't balance it

ANDZ

[Drake1793]

Wait. Your engine smoke after 3000rpm? How do you use your camper? If you use constantly on 1500-2500 rpm with the egr open is normal.
You have to add.
-Oil vapours
-All the crap that your van build up in 160.000km with the egr.
and you will obtain a huge smoke.
Mine right now doesn't smoke.
try to close the egr by a piece of sheet metal 0.8mm, clean the line from the egr to the inlet + clean the inlet sensor pressure( at the end of the egr tube- it's only one sensor(clean with a dry contact cleaner) and the inlet manifold.
+ if you want you can apply an oil catch can.
But for first if you take apart your turbo you have to rebuild it.