The awful timing drive of the Duratorq

[andypdq]

I'm approaching 60, so I'm a grumpy old fart, I can't hold it in any longer. The timing drive of the Duratorq is abysmal. It's obvious how it could be sorted, but Ford never addressed the issue.

The inlet cam has a small angle of "wrap" regarding the timing chain and the cam sprocket, this is just bad, you don't have to be an engineer to see the problem. The slightest slack in the timing chain and the chain jumps and pistons hit valves, then rips the cam carrier from the cylinder head and they're both trash.

The obvious solution would be to place an idler sprocket towards the centre line of the engine to give a good wrap around the inlet cam sprocket. They went to this trouble with the serpentine auxiliary drive belt, but they couldn't be arsed to apply the same principle to the more important timing drive.

Help me understand???

[metalworker0]

The Designers/ Engineers / Draughtsmen are now cad technicians with swivel chairs who have grown up with Nintendo and play station and have only virtual and no real world experience .

all the best.mark

[knobby1]

I'm approaching 60, so I'm a grumpy old fart, I can't hold it in any longer. The timing drive of the Duratorq is abysmal. It's obvious how it could be sorted, but Ford never addressed the issue.

The inlet cam has a small angle of "wrap" regarding the timing chain and the cam sprocket, this is just bad, you don't have to be an engineer to see the problem. The slightest slack in the timing chain and the chain jumps and pistons hit valves, then rips the cam carrier from the cylinder head and they're both trash.

The obvious solution would be to place an idler sprocket towards the centre line of the engine to give a good wrap around the inlet cam sprocket. They went to this trouble with the serpentine auxiliary drive belt, but they couldn't be arsed to apply the same principle to the more important timing drive.

Help me understand???

Only 60 eh..?? I've got hemorrhoids that have had more birthdays..

This doesn't apply to the FWD Mk7 as it has substantially more "chain teeth" engaged than the others as the fuel pump isn't driven directly by the cam chain. Agree about the others though.

Mk7 FWD here:

FORD-TRANSIT-2-2-EURO-4-SILNIK-JAK-NOWY-2006-Typ-samochodu-Samochody-dostawcze.jpg

Lord Knobrot

[Altransit]

But they have now sorted the issue


The new 2.0 Euro6 Transits now have a timing belt running in oil, which causes even more collateral damage when it fails

[knobby1]

But they have now sorted the issue


The new 2.0 Euro6 Transits now have a timing belt running in oil, which causes even more collateral damage when it fails

That's true...makes the old chain setup look rather good then.

Lord Knobrot

[andypdq]

I have a 1966 Massey Ferguson 135 tractor, bought by my late father brand new, it has the Perkins 152 cubic inch 3 cylinder engine. It's been fantastically reliable. It's had one set of pistons and liners fitted, due to it completing over 10,000 hours of service, it has a substantial helical gear timing drive train, which is as good as new. No timing drive service required since 1966. Progress??

[knobby1]

I have a 1966 Massey Ferguson 135 tractor, bought by my late father brand new, it has the Perkins 152 cubic inch 3 cylinder engine. It's been fantastically reliable. It's had one set of pistons and liners fitted, due to it completing over 10,000 hours of service, it has a substantial helical gear timing drive train, which is as good as new. No timing drive service required since 1966. Progress??

Agree...."Made to last" is what you call that. Timing chains and belts are a way of cutting costs and weight instead using proper gears and bearings to do it right....no tensioners to fail, no chains or belts to fail.....totally reliable.

Lord Knobrot

[andypdq]

But they have now sorted the issue


The new 2.0 Euro6 Transits now have a timing belt running in oil, which causes even more collateral damage when it fails

What? you're not showing signs of cynicism are you?

[andz327]

Awful unreliable engines them mk7 fwd E4

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[Altransit]

But they have now sorted the issue


The new 2.0 Euro6 Transits now have a timing belt running in oil, which causes even more collateral damage when it fails

What? you're not showing signs of cynicism are you?

Cynical? Moi? Never

I was hinting, in my clumsy way, at the fact that the timing chain of the duratorq was/is inherantly more reliable than the belt of the later replacement, or even the earlier Di, (although not as catastrophic on the Di).
Some of the duratorq's have many hundreds of thousand miles on the clock without suffering any problems with the chain

[andz327]

But they have now sorted the issue


The new 2.0 Euro6 Transits now have a timing belt running in oil, which causes even more collateral damage when it fails

What? you're not showing signs of cynicism are you?

Cynical? Moi? Never

I was hinting, in my clumsy way, at the fact that the timing chain of the duratorq was/is inherantly more reliable than the belt of the later replacement, or even the earlier Di, (although not as catastrophic on the Di).
Some of the duratorq's have many hundreds of thousand miles on the clock without suffering any problems with the chain

Your right altranny
Many many many thousands of miles like 700,008 miles

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[andypdq]

I was hinting, in my clumsy way, at the fact that the timing chain of the duratorq was/is inherantly more reliable than the belt of the later replacement, or even the earlier Di, (although not as catastrophic on the Di).
Some of the duratorq's have many hundreds of thousand miles on the clock without suffering any problems with the chain[/quote]Your right altranny
Many many many thousands of miles like 700,008 miles

Yes, you're correct but the only ones which have done that mileage will have had attentive owners who ensure any potential problem is addressed as soon as there are any signs of trouble, which is how it should be done.

The unfortunate reality is that when a vehicle gets old, it's sold by the well off owner to someone who's not so well off who just keeps driving it until it fails. If you have the old Di, if the cam belt fails, then the worst you'll likely see is bent pushrods or some snapped rocker arms, a cheap fix, when the timing drive fails on the duratorq, it's a much more expensive prospect.

[andypdq]

Scroll down the page a bit and you'll see a photo of an engine with yellow paint,not the exact engine but similar, does the duratorq's timing drive look more robust?

https://thefarmingforum.co.uk/index.php ... ng.216110/

[andypdq]

Agree...."Made to last" is what you call that. Timing chains and belts are a way of cutting costs and weight instead using proper gears and bearings to do it right....no tensioners to fail, no chains or belts to fail.....totally reliable.

Lord Knobrot[/quote]


Exactly, belts and chains are cheap and nasty. I've had a bit of experience of "General Aviation", light aircraft to you and me, and guess what? The vast majority of piston engine planes in service have gear driven timing, if you need to ask why, well... Continental and Lycoming.

[andypdq]

It's rather strange that super reliable chain driven timing is almost unknown in certified, single piston engined aircraft.