Clutch disintegrates at 12700 miles

[mad andy]

Hi there..we have a 04 registered transit 350 115 hp tipper and have had problems with a smelly smoking clutch from day 1. The van has done light towing with no more than 1.25 tonne trailer / grass cutting machine. and have just had the clutch disintegrate at just under 13000 miles. Ford has told us that this is normal wear an tear even though the van has only been used for 8 months of last year and has not towed anything for 2 months over the winter. Has anyone else had this problem?
We own two older shaped transits one a r reg vrewcab and another a t reg both tippers and had no problems. One clutch on the R reg was replaced at 110 000 miles which is pretty normal and this was doing the same work as the new one..

any input would be much appreciated because obviously we feel a little hard done by with the £850 bill..

thanks

Mad Andy and the manor estates crew

[100ps_drw_hicube]

mate i thought we were ripped off £160 for a clutch on a 98 2.5td but £850 what else did they do ??? i would want a new engine for that money

[daddy cool]

Whatever happened to warranty? That can't be right

[FredTransit]

Mate, sounds like a rip off to me. I think I would be 'mad fred' if somebody handed me as bigger bill.

[xbox360]

I herd of a cluch going at 85 miles so the firm sacked the driver got the van fixed then the clutch went again a couple of hundred miles later with the new driver. they were towing a mini digger.The van was a 350 90ps

[mad andy]

They are telling me that the warranty does not cover the clutch...it took out the flywheel as well.....

They have us by the nuts...its gotta be done at a ford main dealer as we wanna chase ford for the money and they have cracked the clutch open tand have it in bits now ....if we ask them to put it back together then it will cost us the labour again...we are close to going down mob handed and murdering the lot of em...

[FredTransit]

Oh, and I'm about to pay less than half of £850 for a Di engine, 5 speed and ancileries, which I am sure includes a clutch..........

What happened to warranty? Oh, and welcome by the way!?

[FredTransit]

They are telling me that the warranty does not cover the clutch...it took out the flywheel as well.....

They have us by the nuts...its gotta be done at a ford main dealer as we wanna chase ford for the money and they have cracked the clutch open tand have it in bits now ....if we ask them to put it back together then it will cost us the labour again...we are close to going down mob handed and murdering the lot of em...

Seriously, think about taking it higher, or to trading standards (consumer law - goods must be of 'mercantable quality', ie fit for the job) or threaten them with the press (the Sun is a good one, nobody buys it yet they have millions of readers) or Watchdog. Also, wait outside till the showroom or reception is full, then go in and complain about it in a VERY loud voice.

[Nighthawk]

The clutch is covered against manufacuring defects ONLY, if the lining has been torn away from the driven plate it's been way too hot and slipping before the excessive stresses on it have caused it to shred.

While I feel your pain with such a bill, the dealer is stating the truth with regards to clutch coverage. £850 sounds a bit steep though for just a clutch kit and DMF ask them for an itemised breakdown of the parts and labour. Why not ask them to repair it at warranty rates the labour costs and parts cost will be less than retail then

It can be normal for smells to come from the bell housing too, A letter explaining the cause was sent out to dealers about 2 years ago. it's a result of removing the lead content of the lining.

You would be quite within your rights to retain the services of an independent engineer to assess the case, your insurance companies legal protection team might be able to suggest an engineer they use. IF that engineer found the cause to be more than likely a fault in the production process it'll add a lot of weight to your warranty claim and FMC will look at the case with a view to providing a satisfactory resolution.

Fred, consumer law is useless here, the clutch fitted to the 115PS duratorq is capable of taking approx 20% more loading than the engine can give. it's NOT a common failure across the model range regardless of what people read on the internets self help forums. If it was a design issue it would have already been addressed with a TSB or Recall action.

Hope some of that helps you m8.

[FredTransit]

Fred, consumer law is useless here, the clutch fitted to the 115PS duratorq is capable of taking approx 20% more loading than the engine can give. it's NOT a common failure across the model range regardless of what people read on the internets self help forums. If it was a design issue it would have already been addressed with a TSB or Recall action.

Hope some of that helps you m8.

I bow to your superior knowledge Nighthawk (and I am not being sarcy here), but I can't see how the Ford Motor Company can be above consumer law, specially as you say the clutch is good for 20% more power than the engine can give. Surely this begs the question that isn't there something wrong with this clutch?

[mad andy]

Hi there again..

we complained about smoke coming from the clutch and smells also 2 months after we bought it but they explained it away by saying that the asbestos had been removed from the clucth so we took thier word for it..I am the boss of the company and i drive this transit normally but the guy who has been driving it for the past month is a car enthusiast in his spare time and he builds hot rods and classic cars for a hobby so he is probably more aware of clutches and thier limits than i am..my other guys drive the older transits..nissan cabstars..nissan navarras and mitsubishi l200's..all these vehicles tow the same machine and we have had no other failing clutches or problems.

We are taking the damaged clutch and flywheel away and are taking legal advice as we are pretty pissed off with this.
Thanks for the welcome and the replies...all the input is most welcome.

Cheers

mad andy and the manor estates crew

[Nighthawk]

Fred,

The fact that the clutch will stand more torque loading than the engine can provide is proof positive that the item is "fit for the purpose"
That is the description the Trading standards would be trying to enforce.

It's quite possible for any driver to kill a clutch in a very short time in any car, I fitted a clutch to a friends Evo FQ320 after 5000 miles of road driving.....the ironic part was it failed on the way to a track day!
But going back to the point, a loaded 3.5 tonne transit with a 1.25 tonne trailer reversing or manuvering with lots of revs and a semi pressed clutch will kill the clutch much quicker than you'd expect. Now thats not a comment about this case because I don't know how it's driven. BUT it's something i've seen and investigated on many transits used by big fleet operators and they've all had a big bill pointed at them too.

The warranty covers the vehicle against manufacturing defects, it doesn't guarantee that things won't break. Proving beyond doubt that this is a direct cause of a sub standard friction lining is the key here and it's going to be difficult i think.

Best of look with it all the same.

[xbox360]

I Know what FQ Stands for

[FredTransit]

Fair enough Nighthawk. I am interested to see how this turns out, though it does seem to be a 'heads you win tails I loose' situation, loaded in favour of the FMC. I would be very pissed off if I had spent tens of thousands of pounds on a transit and then less than two years later had a big repair bill. not what you expect from a large company and a well loved and respected van.

[Nighthawk]

I Know what FQ Stands for

I know what it means too, and I can assure you that the Q was replaced behind the F on several occasissions I think it was an FT a few times and a FPOS several times!!

Fred, i'd be pi$$ed off too, but where do you draw the line on something that is easily affected by factors outside of the vehicle and it's builders control? All manufacturers have the same policy on friction materials, Ford's warranty coverage is much better than most of the other van manufacturers in this respect. A bullet proof Transit could be built and it'd have an extremely low average cost of repair with little extra effort from FMC, the down side is that it would cost 3 times the price

No point having an ultra reliable un breakable vehicle, if no one buys it