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2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

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2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby HovisTheCat » Thu Jun 08, 2023 9:28 pm

Hello Everyone - Bought a Motorhome on a Ford Transit 2017 FWD Chasis, 2.0L EcoBlue Engine.
Got it home and the following day we got a limp home with a #2 Fuel Injector problem P1202.

Got to the injector and measured the resistance across it and it was very low compared with the others, clearly it had gone bad. Took it to a local garage to have it swapped after reading horror stories about them getting ceased in (including one Australian man on YouTube loosing his mind, which was amusing)

Back on the road, no problems. After a 2hr drive home from our first trip of 2 days driving about, parked on the drive. Engine off, remembered i needed to get to one of the lockers, turned the key to back it up a bit and no start. Called the AA who thought it was fuel pump and towed it back to the same garage where it currently resides.

At first, if you left it overnight, it would start first time. At one point it idled for a couple of hours with no problems, then turned it off, turned the key to start again and it just turns over, no start. Its detreated from that now - when it does start it runs fine. Garage have checked fuel supply, filters, sender pump, and pressure at the injectors and its all good - in his words "there's just no reason why it shouldn't start"

Mechanic has had someone with a "Better computer" (although I'm unsure if it was the ford IDS or not) to take a look and he thinks its a timing issue. Codes we get are as follows.

P062D-00 - Fuel Injector Driver Circuit Performance Bank 1
P0216-04 - Injector / Injection Timing Control Circuit - System Internal Failure
P0A09-00 - DC / DC Converter Fault Circuit Low (Which we believe may be irrelevant due to how the 240V Charger works for the habitation part of the van - this was the AA Man's thoughts too).

Trying to go down the route of getting the dealer to resolve this, not having much luck.

Working theory now is that the fuel injector pump timing may be off? curious if anyone thinks that could be the problem - I've also read articles saying there might be a cam in the pump that needs setting?

Can't figure out why we were fine for 2 days of repeated stop and start and suddenly we weren't - what changed?

Any help would be greatly appreciated here as a dream motorhome for the kids and wife has turned into a nightmare.

Thanks all.
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Re: 2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby marcrbarker » Fri Jun 09, 2023 6:44 pm

Question ... did the local garage carry out other work while replacing injector?
I wouldn't had thought Timing adjustmen would slip unless there's tools involved etc.
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Re: 2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby HovisTheCat » Sun Jun 11, 2023 9:46 am

Hello marcrbarker, Thanks for the reply,

They carried out a regular 30k mile service at the same time, but noting involving the timing belt or fuel pump timing. Initially i thought it was just bad luck to lose an injector so soon, and particularly after #1 failed 2 weeks prior.
Now i'm starting to think this is a long standing problem prior to us owning it and the injector failure is the symptom not the cause. Looking at its MOT's its only done 4k miles in 3 years, at first i thought that was just because it was a motorhome, but now i'm thinking it might have been left because it isn't reliable.

Since posting we've found out it had a whole new engine 3000 miles ago - it was done at a Ford garage so you'd expect it to be done well? wondering if the fuel pump isn't timed right, it will run, just not start well perhaps?

The dealer is being obstructive, says "i've got you a warranty - use that" my take on it is that its less than 30 days so its his problem to fix - i have no faith he'll acknowledge the fault is on him so I'm stuck trying to figure this out - or it'll have to go to Ford for their take on things......
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Re: 2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby marcrbarker » Sun Jun 11, 2023 11:15 am

About timing you mention. I guess timing is working theory because it's mentioned in the DTC. A DTC doesn't directly say what's wrong, it's just an error code. Some neccesary condition isn't getting met and the DTC identifies which subsystem is having trouble.

Timing isn't adjusted in servicing and so can't slip out of adjustment, not an adjusted setting of pump position. Diesel timing today is based on a precisely fitted fixed crankshaft datum position sensor and there's a quartz crystal regulated timing advance/retard according to fixed ROM memory maps. The actual timing may well go slightly off every now and again briefly for a fraction of a second, can hear engine rattle occasionaly. There's a watchdog running the whole time, measuring exactly when the injection happens in relation to the crankshaft position, it checks and makes timing corrections by moving little valves with 'PWM' signals, all automatic, and (maybe not a good idea in some ways) these built in control devices rely on other things like fuel pressure to work properly (instead of working independently). So if for some reason the correction device can't do its job through no fault of its own, this device that can't do its job gets a mention in the DTC -- and then gets the blame.

The change in technomogy is rather like the old TVs that had a "vertical hold" adustment round the back. Some TVs would slip and get a rolling picture so reach round back and adjust. Then TVs became crystal controlled and no need for adjustments.
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Re: 2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby HovisTheCat » Sun Jun 11, 2023 12:23 pm

Very interesting, So its unlikely to have slipped then - i think this problem existed before the injector swap and service, just at the time when we had a hot start problem (and we did) we figured it was the fault of the injector - now I'm pretty convinced its the other way around.

So unless its been installed wrong then it could be a bad pump or the sensor on the top of the pump could have gone bad. Little frustrated that its locked up at a garage, or else i would take a look at the sensor itself for a bad connection maybe.

Perhaps a trip to Ford is the next most logical thing to do - get a deeper diagnostic report.

Thankyou so much for your detailed replies.
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Re: 2017 2.0L EcoBlue Hot Start Issue

Postby marcrbarker » Sun Jun 11, 2023 2:47 pm

Yes. Rather than local garage I think Ford or a fuel injection specialist.
Trouble with technology in consumer products is it's an art that goes beyond what the average person in the street can relate to or properly comprend fully. The TVs years after they lost the knobs round the back people still used to say "the tube is going" for almost any fault.
Engines now interconnected mesh of interdependent subsystems that when one acts up - it causes another subsystem to go wrong until something finally happens like a banging noise or smoke, which we consider as the problem. And by then there could be a collection of stored codes coming and going.
We tend to only deal with the things we know about and can relate to (checking connections, cleaning things etc), while ignore things we don't know about that quite often don't care a bit if they're dirty or less than perfect connection. When a petrol/gasoline engine starts running rough first thing people do change the spark plugs, I would guess if pistons were easier to unscrew than plugs we'd be replacing pistons instead!

Maybe others tuned in here have more advice. I'm more a troller than a regular contributor here..
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