about to buy a mk 5..with EPIC....! ...?

[yoeddynz]

Hello- please see also our first post in buyers guide section. we are thinking of buying a 1997 2.5 turbo with what i presume is the epic pump. Our past transits have been fully mechanical which I love.

The current owner is having troubles with the ecu going into limp home mode and he is getting a new APS for the throttle. Otherwise its a very well serviced van. I'll ask when it last had the cam belt done.

Question is- are the Epic setups really that bad. My thoughts are that if it was that shocking we wouldnt be seeing so many transits about and they wouldn't have the fantastic 'go on for ever' tag attached.

We typed in 'epic problem' into search and of course then get all the problems- but everyone is quick to mention when there is a problem eh.....

So are they a reliable system and what should we be looking for as far as warnings, servicing, preventative maintenance to stop any problems with the system.

Will most ford garages have the right code readers for this system? (we live in NZ)

Or should we just buy a old toyota..........

thanks in advance.
alex

[yoeddynz]

just been doing some more searching on epic related topics and found this-
Look at very bottom of page and what is said of the epic...

http://www.dieselbob.co.uk/vegetable.asp

[trigger]

Speak to Andy g on here, he's the Epic guru

[MinorMatt]

There are 2 common faults with the epic pump...

They are very sensitive to the timing, so if the cambelt is worn it will go out of perameters and go in to limp home mode. From what I have seen here that accounts for about 60% of the problems! (service interval = 50,000 miles or 5 years). The belt MUST be replaced using timing pins

The next most common problem is the ESOS (Electronic Shut Off Solenoid) and that manifests itself as not being able to turn the engine off with the key (You have to stall it). Its a fairly simple and cheap repair that can be done in situ - but most garages would want you to spend 1000s on a new pump.

Unfortunately the only diagnostic machine that will read the codes is the "Lucas Laser 2000" and not many people have them.

If all goes wrong you can convert to an injection pump from a non-turbo, but you would need the throttle pedal and cable too.

[coresaint]

There are 2 common faults with the epic pump...

They are very sensitive to the timing, 3. so if the cambelt is worn it will go out of perameters and go in to limp home mode. From what I have seen here that accounts for about 60% of the problems! (service interval = 50,000 miles or 5 years). The belt MUST be replaced using timing pins

1. The next most common problem is the ESOS (Electronic Shut Off Solenoid) and that manifests itself as not being able to turn the engine off with the key (You have to stall it). Its a fairly simple and cheap repair that can be done in situ - but most garages would want you to spend 1000s on a new pump.

Unfortunately the only diagnostic machine that will read the codes is the "Lucas Laser 2000" and not many people have them.

2. If all goes wrong you can convert to an injection pump from a non-turbo, but you would need the throttle pedal and cable too.

1. I have experienced this, as has Matt, he had my EPIC in bits to repair the plunger! I too had a terrible time getting the plunger, everywhere kept trying to sell us a new pump...

2. if you have a turbo auto, YOU NEED THE EPIC, it controls the automatic timing.

3. also had that done, deffo good to get it replaced.

when they work they work well, AndyG can read these fault codes I think. you can tell if theres a fault at hand by looking at the engine light.

put key in pos III and start engine

look at engine light if goes out immediately then fine

if stays on for a bit then deminishes then you have a minor fault or warning

if stays on then major fault

if stays on and in limp then major engine fault.


hope that helps.

[hifly]

don't think about running a lucas pump on veg oil, proper biodiesel should be ok but not straight oil.

[Altransit]

Lucas pumps generally are not keen on veg oil or biodiesel, the Bosch pumps are more tolerant
I wouldn't risk either one with an EPIC pump

[alanwh]

Personally I wouldn't even put Supermarket diesel in it

[MinorMatt]

coresaint... I changed your cambelt because it was going in to limp home mode

[yoeddynz]

WOW- thank you very much fellas for all the quick replys! I have to wait till the morning to answer them because whilst you fellas are out throwing snowballs i'm fast asleep...

Anyway- I will first find out when the belt was last replaced. I know its well serviced religously- oil changed every 6000 miles ( all my old cars I always do them at 3000)

If belt has not be been replaced within intervals then I can do it but- the pully locking kits- should most ford garages have them - are they universal ones like what you'd get from local factor or something special with flashing lights and bells that only real mechanics get to play with ?

Is the APS pickup a common fault?

And the esos - if that became faulty can ya just whack in a known good second hand one?

Biggie is- if we head for the hills with the mountain bikes in the back can the epic have a fault that will make the AA man tear his hair out and have us riding home on bikes? Or will at worst it just go in to limp home mode?

This transit will be a new era for us as far as vans go - our last two ford vans were mechanical injection, our bedford TK house truck was mechanical, my lovely sadly missed '96 Iveco was mechanical injection.

We really like our old cars for two reasons- they are sooooooooooo much cooler to drive and look at then modern plastic bubbles but mainly because we know them well and can always fix them if they go wrong - which is actually very very rare especially if ignition is in fine fettle! Hence our only other car is in a container on its way over to NZ right now is my trusty old '69 Vauxhall HB viva (with a 1660 ford crossflow fitted of course )

Oh- btw... we WONT be running it on biodiesel or chip oil etc- just clean diesel from the pump!

alex

[Altransit]

The universal Ford timing pin set, by "Draper" has the necessary correct pins to do the timing on the Di engine. Mine cost me around £15 in the UK

[MinorMatt]

as im sure you know anything could leave you stranded... but the epic would only go in to limp home. extremely unlikely to fail totally. i have never heard of it happening!

[yoeddynz]

cool - thats what i want to hear!

what does limp mode mean- does it lower boost on turbo and rev limit etc? how fast can you go in limp mode?

[psv-hgv-flt]

cool - thats what i want to hear!

what does limp mode mean- does it lower boost on turbo and rev limit etc? how fast can you go in limp mode?

2000 rpm max

[coresaint]

coresaint... I changed your cambelt because it was going in to limp home mode

yeh that was right.

been fine though ever since.