Injector and dpf failure on low miles 69 plate Adblue

[Van Friday]

Hi there. I am looking for advice on a rather expensive issue.

I have been told by the Transit Centre here in Manchester, UK that my 2019 Trend 170hp needs 4 injectors and the complete DPF system replacing. The bill is likely to be around £4000. The thing is the van has only done 10,000 miles. In fact it has only done 1000 miles since the same dealer serviced the engine and replaced the injectors under warranty 20 months ago. The reason for the low miles is that I am only using it occasionally as we're currently converting it in our spare time. Ford have told us that this is the reason for the failure. Apparently the lack of use caused the injector seals to dry out and the faulty injectors then destroyed the DPF. I asked if they could clean/regen the DPF but apparently not. The dealer has requested some consideration from Ford and they have offered around 20% off the bill.

The symptoms were the amber spanner light coming on and the engine going into limp mode. I booked it in and on the morning of the garage appointment the amber engine light came on too. Apart from the limp home mode it seemed to drive well though it is a bit smelly when cold. Also I've just had an oil service notification. (Again after just 1000 miles)

So, should I accept Ford's offer, ask for more, or do I go down the wormhole of getting the injectors removed and fixed by a specialist followed by finding someone to attemp to fix the DPF? (From watching Youtube it seems they are more difficult to access on the later Adblue engines)

Does anyone have any similar experiences? Does anyone know of good specialists that could help me find a cheaper solution? I can ask a local company to run the diagnostic so I can post the failure codes if that helps.

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks

[loot]

So the garage changed the injectors under warranty but it is now put off warranty so they are binning you off?
I would say personally that despite it being out of warranty that the problem is in fact continuous with the same problem.
If there is something in the warranty small print that says you have to run the engine for a minimal time to keep it working.

Can you clarify injector seals? It sounds like they're saying rubber seals that hands gone dry and failed? I'm not that familiar with the panther injectors but I've not really seen rubber inside injectors, sounds like hobbits mischief to me.

If they've wiped their hands with you then go private.

4 new injectors will cost about £800 max. Maybe 100 quid to install and program.

Dpf may be serviced with the programming and a forced regeneration.

My brother has the 17 plate euro 6 ad blu and I think similar problem to you and it was just a sensor on the intercooler I think.

I suggest trying another ford garage for a second opinion before spending money.

They offered 20% so it still 3200 for 4 injectors and possibly new dpf.

Did you get any fault codes can you share them?

[loot]

Ps I'm sure the spanner light is just the service minder that you can reset.

I appreciate the lights have come on but can you confirm it is actually running in limp mode?

[dumper]

Have a look on YouTube at O’Reilly autos if anyone can sort it he will it means taking it to him but could be worth the trip

[loot]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=199081

[Van Friday]

Thanks to you both for your replies; much appreciated.

On the first point about the nature of these seals that are supposed to have dried out; I have had a look at some injectors online and the only seals I can see are firstly the copper washers for the injector to head seal and then the metal/metal needle/seal. Am I being lied to here? I think you are quite right about these being ongoing issues; Parkers state in their review that they have heard of issues outside of the admitted 2019 coating issue. I will mention this in another appeal to Ford.

Also relevant is the lack of written service requirements to ensure the vehicle is regularly used for long journeys; how are we to know? This will also go in my appeal. ( Unless anyone can point me to these service requirements)

Assuming I get no where with Ford then what next? On the one hand we want this van to be 100% reliable so we can sleep soundly in it at night. On the other hand thats an awful lot of money and I agree that there is a good chance that the DPF side could be fixable. So next week I will get the fault codes read and shared on here. I will also contact some specialists for their advice. Also I will quizz the dealer as to what a "failed DPF" really is. After all surely this conclusion can only be based on readings from the various temperature and pressure sensors together with the refusal of the DPF to regenerate. I can't believe there is a "Failure" sensor?! But as you suggested I'm sure the regen failure could also be due to other factors such as oil quality and faulty sensors. You see, I have been watching Mr O'Reilly!

Thanks again for your help guys!

[metalworker0]

if you look at O'Reilly's stuff ..you'll have to watch quite a few ..
he tells you how the whole system works

as far as i know ,the sensors are pressure sensors that measure the pressure in the exhaust and compare the difference before and after the dpf ..one sensor before one after..this works out via computer wizardary how blocked it is .

in O'Reillys world there isn't ever any need to replace a dpf until its done a very high mileage, he walks you through the faults and cures, makes it all look very simplistic and easy to understand.


all the best.mark

[MWH]

Get the codes read first and put them up here. Odd 4 newish injectors would fail. My 2016 170hp 2.0 only has copper seals for injector to head and fork clamp with a single bolt to hold them in. I've had to change 2 recently as they came up with a short to ground.

Is yours a fwd out of interest? While it's on a code reader they can check the dpf soot loading/pressure/ miles since last regen etc. One sign of a blocked dpf is your oil level rising as extra diesel used to increase exhaust temprature washes past the rings and down into the sump.

And as others suggest have a look at O'Reilly autos youtube channel, he does a lot of Ford ecoblue engines.

[Van Friday]

Quick update:

Codes read by my business neighbour (but not yet forthcoming)

"Leak test" on injectors done and shows No.2 is different to the others. I have asked my guy to remove all four and send them off to PF Jones in Trafford Park for analysis and resoration. Hopefully this will all happen while I'm away next week.

Incidentally, after doing the tests my guy left the cover off the engine. It snowed on Tuesday and this morning a large pool of water was found on the cylinder head. We're guessing the melt water got behind the plastic scuttle tray just below the glass. What a crap design! I'm assuming this is a common issue so I'll have a trawl through the forum for solutions.

Cheers

[Van Friday]

Update;

So while I was away the injectors were taken to PF Jones who couldn't find much wrong with them but agreed to put them through their cleaning process anyway. These were refitted and a forced regen carried out. All lights are now off when driving though the spanner light did reappear for a few seconds. My chap suspects that one of the glow plugs is faulty as the engine is slow to start from cold and runs lumpy for a few seconds. Once hot it's fine.

So for now its all fingers crossed, do an oil and filter service, fit a new battery and see how the glow plug gos.

What is the protocol on naming and shaming Ford dealers on this forum? After all they both charged me a diagnostic fee to tell me I need to pay them circa £4000 for new injectors and DPF system when, hopefully, that simply isn't the case. Their behaviour is barely legal isn't it? Has anyone else had a similar experience?

Cheers everyone
Mike

[metalworker0]

Tell the truth, yes ..but i was 17 ...it taught me to do my own stuff and not trust any of them. that was 45 years ago.

but that was in a time when things were simpler and easy to understand...now i'd probably hesitate, there is a lot going on with these newer vehicles that im struggling to understand. if they get any more complicated, no one but the engineer who thought the things up will understand.

all the best.mark

[dumper]

Yes mark I’m in the same situation as you been a plant and transport fitter till retirement the last two companies I worked for had a dedicated auto electrician although the last company would send you on training courses to cover their own backsides when things went wrong they wouldn’t supply the equipment to do any electrical work and the electrician from the larger depot come and did the job.

[loot]

You need to be familiar with electronics,computer programming and mechanics these days. But certainly if you know a fair amount of the above and are happy to watch YouTube then you can stay in the game. I will lend my hand to absolutely anything just so the man can suck it when he tells me "you can't" and no that's not rhyming slang

(all within the confines of safety and practicality)